Anyone know what the U.S. Forest Servive has planned for off road vehicle use in the National Forest ??? Thanks.
Scorpio

Uho You just open the can :whistle:

I would like to know too. :huh:

I don't think the forest service even knows. They change it from day to day and keep pushing back the date for closure of some trails. There will still be tons of riding around Mena though.

Ronnie

Didn't the ATV enthusiasts just have a gathering at Jannsen Park or the old armory this past weekend?

Yes there was a rally this past weekend. Very informative and the city leaders were very possitive with their support. There is also going to be a rally at Wolf Creek Springs this weekend. Fun- Food-Fellowship. Sponsered by the Arkansas Trail Blazers Atv Club, and several local and State wide sponsers.

NH

Looks like the new MVUM will not be out until at least the end of the year now, if that soon. It is so shot full of holes right now that there is no way it can come out.
Yep there was a support rally in Mena Saturday and it came off quite well for the first one. Support is growing daily.

Support for what? Making the rich richer, and tearing up the forest floors?

Who is getting rich by riding an ATV? Sounds like somebody could be a little jealous they don't own a cabin that is rented every weekend.
Tearing up the forest floor is another good one. I guess logging the forest is much better since all the trees are cut down and lots off small ones are destroyed from the skidders. What about all the new roads they have to build to get to the trees. That ought to be better for bird watching. :scratch:

Ronnie

Next they will be wanting to close the lakes because of the residue the boats leave in the water. .............I for one love riding the trails but I don't trash them.

I too, enjoy riding the Forest Service roads and the occasional jaunt through the woods. Many of the greatest views and scenery is atop the ridges in our area. Most of which don't have roads or designated trails. Not everyone is physically able to hike for miles to reach these remote locations. I try my best to tread lightly. Most of the time you cant even tell where I've been. The people that are destroying the local forest are doing so because they want to. The problem isn't ATVs in general, but the idiots that ride them. I hate to see my riding restricted due to some moronic vandal.
I would appreciate any information concerning where I can and can't ride my ATV on Forest Service land.

Scorpio, the Forest Service has a map that will come out that will show all open roads for vehicle use, it is know as the MVUM, Motorized Vehicle Use Map. I hope anyone that enjoys riding in the Ouachita National Forest, either in a Car, Truck, Motorcycle, Dirt Bike, or an ATV understands that the road closures are for any motorized vehicle not just ATV's. ( I keep hearing Trails are being closed - they are not ATV Trails, they are roads that we have all driven on) When the MVUM does get signed and becomes effective we are all going to be loosing access to OUR National Forest, unless you walk or ride a bicycle.

If the MVUM contains just half of what some are saying, there are going to be a lot of unhappy outdoorsmen in the Ouachita Naional Forest. The Forest Service will not show the "possible road closures" to the general public until the final decision is made as to what is open and what is closed. After this decision is made and the document is signed the "general public" has 45 days to appeal what they don't like. 105 days after the MVUM document is published it becomes effective.

Pam, Thanks for the info. Do you know when the map will be made available and where I can get one? Thank you.
Scorpio

Scorpio I wish I could answer your question! No one has any idea when the MVUM will be available for the public to view. Norm Wagoner, the district supervison out of Hot Springs, is the person that will sign the document. I have heard several dates that the MVUM could be signed and it has not happened, the last I heard was it will probably be sometime in December, but it could be signed tomorrow. When it is signed, it will be published in the Arkansas Democrat/Gazette.

The Forest Service does not have a date when the MVUM must be in place evidently. In 2005 the MVUM was "mandated" by the Forest Service out of Washington DC to be in place by 2010 in every National Forest in the United States. The above statements are how I have preceived the process of the MVUM to have been done, I could be mistaken, if so, I apologize and stand corrected. The MVUM has been a long and difficult process getting to this point for everyone involved with it............ and the process continues...............

and continues and continues and continues and continues! If and when they get it done I can gaurantee that there will be massive appeals as to the MVUM itself. The way it was done, allowing another entity to mess with it after the previous comment period and many other issues with it. As I said before it is shot through with holes and really could have been a quite simple process. As with anything when the government touches it it turns directly to :bullS: just like magic.

I hope my county road is on that MVUM, maybe i could get some peace and quiet. :banghead:

FS has no say over county roads and on the MVUM. If I can show I am riding from a trail to a trail it is legal to ride that road. Sorry, but that is a fact. MVUM will not have anything to do with county roads. Besides if it were on the MVUM it would mean it was open.

That in itself is the problem. So i reckon if they shut the trails down there would be no legal reason to drive by my house. Therfore i say shut em down. :thumb:

Mopar, what would your favorite Sport be? :thumb:

Shutting down the trails won't stop people from riding on the county roads.

Here we go again!!! I have thought about this whole thing over and over and over, upside down and side ways and am starting to mellow just a little bit. I love this place we live in. It is beautiful BUT/AND it belongs to all of us!!! I hate that but it does!!! Having said that, I still wish the main trails were away from those clear beautiful creeks. That is the only real problem I have aside from the noise. I think the performance style atv's should be restricted to special trail areas where erosion is not a concern. I also think that the ir should be governors and rev limiters and very quiet mufflers installed on all the atv's for those wanting un fettered access to the national forest. I think that atv's ARE a great way to view all the beauty that surrounds us. I just wish there was a way to instill responability into everyone who would want to do this. Oh what a quandry.

The F.S. Motor Vehicle Use law is not just about the use of ATV's and other off-road vehicles. It limits access to public lands by all forms of transportation. It even limits the times of year that you can access your forest. Some current roads will even be gated closed!

Lets look at FS 512 over by Buckey Retreat. There is private land down in there with a couple of houses built also. On the last proposal I saw if you start at the main road there at Buckey and head east on 512 to where it goes from trail to road it will be closed to ALL motorized vehicles. If it is closed to all motorized vehicles how will these people have access to thier land and home? I bet those people have no clue what is about to happen. Are they going to have to walk or will they have to ride a bike. This is just some of the Forest service and thier brilliant ideas. Maybe when the new maps come out it will be changed.

Ronnie

Toss up between Nascar racing and football. :D

http://nohvcclibrary.forestry.uga.edu/ei%20soil%20water.html


actually studies have been performed that show how atv's have a very minimal impact on creeks.


but curious enough cattle have a very very much higher negative impact on creeks



we need to ban cattle from all water sources that exit the owners property :scratch:

I don't know about the comparison between cattle and 4-wheelers, but you are right livestock can have a negative effect on water sources. The NRCS (Natural Resources Conservation Service) are paying livestock owners to fence their livestock out of water sources so that they can't get in it and mess in it. It is an attempt to help improve water quality. Just thought I'd let you know that it is being addressed.

I think it is a great idea to pay farmers to fence cattle out of water sources that exit their property. It would be nice to see some of our local streams reverted back to a pristine state. Except for siltation pollution, I don't think 4-wheelers have a great impact on water quality, it is just the noise and the people that want to tear up the ground doing do-nuts etc. and the one's who use the national forest as one big dumpground.

Has anybody watched when they put a new bridge in across a creek or river. I watched them dig out the dirt for the last one in WPG and it would take months and months for ATV's to turn up as much silt in the water as one track hoe did in 3-4 hours. You would have thought there was a mud slide going down the river when they were digging it out. The forest service wants to say ATV's are to blame for the silt in the creeks and it is harming thier save the minnow program. The forest service needs to go look in the mirror and actually see what they are doing.

Ronnie

Opening morning of muzzle loadin was a bust. Tried to hunt in the shady area, to no avail. 4 wheelers trailers every where. Out of towners ridin everywhere, must have counted 50 + atv's thru the course of the day. All these letters to the congress people, I'm writing my own. Tired of not being able to hunt, tired of the noise, tired of the traffic, be glad to see them shut down.

The locals are dumping trash by the truck loads all over the forest, not the ATV'ers. Kind of hard to carry a stove, sofa and tv on the back of a wheeler.
I can show you several places with local trash.

Although I can see your angst and can't say I would not feel the same way, if you don't like company then don't hunt on public land. I don't complain about hunters screwing up my ride because I know if I am on public land they are welcome too. I don't complain about having to yield to horses bikers and hikers and although they may not be in the WPG area they are out there too. Should they give up thier recreation also so you can have the whole forest to yourself. What are you going to do if thousands of good hunting area acres get shut down so the ATV'ers can ride without having to run into you? Go get a hunting lease if you don't care for the consequences of hunting on public property. If we were talking about you fishing on a lake, you would want the swimmers, boaters, skiers and jet skiers banned I bet.
That being said I will be out there next weekend partaking in my favorite form of recreation. Now would that be hunting, hiking, horse back riding, atv'ing or riding a bike???

I to have seen the trash that Arkyrider is talking about. It sounds like Mopar is saying lets get rid of all the ATV's and out of state people but he says nothing about his neighbors dumping trash in the forest.

Ronnie

It's Autumn, folks.....the colors of the leaves are changing....tourist time!
This is the perfect time of year for enjoying the beautiful Autumn colors via bike, ATV, horseback or any other means of transportation.

We'll wait on that MVU thingy to come out, then we'll see. In the mean time I'll continue to tell my congress people what fine job their doing by restricting trails and roads. Was being pretty quiet about the whole deal as of late, but srewing up my huntin is where i draw the line. Oh, and my huntin screwing up your'e ridin :scratch: , Lost me on that one. I'm in and out of the woods with nobody knowing i was there. Unlike your'e beloved 4 wheelers runnin around makin all kinds of racket.

Because when I do know there is a hunter in the area I go another direction. So my ride is screwed up.
But thats it, I am selling both of my machines because as you say the FS is gonna mess it up anyway. And of course I don't want to offend you as a hunter. Right like that is gonna happen.
What you going to do when they shut down the area you hunt to all vehicles, or better yet to all access which means kiss your hunting good by. You seem to be missing the whole point that when they start taking access away they tend to keep going at it until you have zero access. Have you ever stopped to think that just maybe if you were to work with us to save trails and riding areas we may just be more then happy to help restrict riding i some areas during hunting season. As responsible atv'ers some of us do beleive in cooperation. Some of us have worked on trails that we cannot ride because they are for two wheel only. I would help on a horse trail if asked. So you see cooperation may just get you exactly what you want. But we can all see you have a one track way of thinking.
By the way would you like to come over to my placeat the end of this hunting season? I would like to take you down around lake Ouachita to help clean up the trash after the leave. Every year matresses, chairs, used diapers and whatever else you can think up get dumped right at the end of hunting season. Kind of strange isn't it? I mean I wonder who is leaving that stuff?

Are you hunting on public or private land? If you are hunting on public land then you have no reason to whine because everybody has the right to be on it. If you are hunting private land next to public land I guess you are SOL again.
Do you really think the MVUM is going to stop the ATV's? If you do you are mistaken. They have jurisdiction over anything that is a forest road or trail and that is it. All the county roads will still be OK to ride so the atv's will still come. Looks as if you are going to just have to deal with it or find you another place to hunt. :har:
Why no comment on the trash. It looks as if someone is avoiding it.

Ronnie

I don't know how it is now, but when I was a little kid around here, deer hunters did leave a lot of trash, old furniture in the woods. They would take old reclyners and couches, etc to deer camp and jusst leav'um there. I don't think the atv'ers are responsible for so much trash, but the noise is unbearable. I grew up here and remember when you could go out in the woods and be at peace with nature, now that is impossible with the 4-wheeler noise, and they are dangerous, if they are to have unfettered access to the national forest, they need to be equiped with noise restricting mufflers and governed engines, if not they need to be severly restricted as to where they can be ridden.

Mopar, I also hunt in the Shady area. I haven't had much problem with the atvs. Most of the time if a person will get out of their truck and off of the road they have a better chance of using a tag. My opening day was great. Got my biggest buck ever. Oh, I rode my atv to my hunting area. Didn't seem to bother him at all. He walked right by it on his way to my stand. :thumb: And just so you know...My letters to my congressmen and women cancel out yours and vice versa so why don't we work toward a suitable common ground? :dunno:

They do have noise level limits along with spark arrestors. As far as power what has that got to do with anything. You can be killed on a motorless bycycle just as easy. Responsible riding, which means knowing your machine, not letting little kids ride adult machines especially unsupervised, wearing proper safety eqipment and by all means leaving the booze at home is the bigger answer to safety. I can't beleive how many people that would not think of drinking a beer while driving a car set out on an atv with a beer in one hand and the handle bars in the other.
Again the machine is as safe as you make it, the user can be a total idiot.

Then why all the hoophla about writin congress folks and parades and all the carrying on I been hearing about. According to your'e last statement you folks can just keep a ridin like nothing happened.As far as the trash being dumped, we have law enforcement runnin them hills that ought to have a handle on that. Or maybe there to busy havein to police all the Atv's. :whistle: