unlikelyheroine PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2005 9:33 pm

Books Nikki read whilst in prison
This thread and all the posts seem to have disappeared from the old board - I thought it was a great idea for a thread so thank you to whoever thought of it, I can't remember who it was!!

OK so the ones I can remember:

Middlemarch - George Eliot

Silas Marner - George Eliot

Sophie's World - Jostein Gardner (of course!!)

The Aspern Papers & The Turn of the Screw - Henry James

The Portrait of a Lady - Henry James

Little Dorrit - Charles Dickens (I think S1 Ep9)

Were there any others? Does anyone know which eps these are in or this is yet another excuse to get my DVDs out...? :D I know Nikki reads a couple of other books but I can't quite see what they are (going to have to pay closer attention to the covers!)

I am reading Silas Marner just at the moment. I have tried reading Middlemarch & The Portrait of a Lady before (not inspired by Nikki's reading in those cases!! :D) but found the early part of these novels pretty hard going. I read Sophie's World and The Aspern Papers & The Turn of the Screw quite a while ago.

I haven't braved Little Dorrit yet!

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unlikelyheroine PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:55 pm

I noticed when watching again that in Series 2 Ep 2, when Fenner starts turning over Nikki's cell trying to find a mobile phone he thinks she has, you can also see that Nikki also has the The Ambassadors by Henry James (the spine is visible when Fenner starts picking up Nikki's books and chucking them around).

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NZ Bad Girl PostPosted: Sat Jun 25, 2005 11:42 am

I read Sophie's World a few years ago, because I wanted to see what Nikki and Helen were on about. I loved most of it, but I hated the ending so much. I don't know how I would feel if I re-read it now, but that's how I felt then.

I am a quarter of the way through Middlemarch, but keep getting distracted by other books. Fingersmith, Imzadi (keep me away from the Star Trek books!), The Wee Free Men (like-wise for Pratchett!), Don Brash's biography (bloody tory) and many many more. I really need to try and read one book at a time.

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Magdalena KR PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:16 pm

And another book read by Nikki would be of course Shakespeare's Juliet and Juliet.. eerrr... I meant - Romeo and Juliet :wink: (series 1, episode 6 "A Big Mistake").

In the very same episode (and scene) another book is mentioned, and although we don't actually see Nikki's reading it, we learn that she knows it (so she must have read it earlier) - that book is Winterson's Oranges Are Not The Only Fruit.

Btw-speaking of the Oranges... - when Nikki hands that book to Helen, Helen looks at the cover and smiles very uncomfortably before she puts it back on the shelf. Maybe she just heard of the book, or guessed what it's about from the title, but it also may be that she has already read this book herself? (I personally think it's the last option :wink:).

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unlikelyheroine PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 9:44 pm

Oh yeah forgot about R + J!! (how could I?!)

Interesting point re Oranges. I had thought at the time that Helen was merely aware of the book's content but you have got me thinking that Helen has read the book before - for, er, purely literature-loving reasons of course :D Laughing Razz

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Janet PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:21 pm

What book does Nikki give Caroline when they are in the library?

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Helen&Nikki4ever PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 8:05 pm

i just bid on 'oranges' on ebay. ive meant to read it for years but never got round to it! so whats sophie's world like? i was thinkin of reading it Wink oh, ive also read imzadi 1 and 2!! im more of a voyager girl tho....anyhoo back to h/n.... i think another two books that helen should read fro inspiration is patricia highsmith's Carol and Erica Fischer's Aimee and Jaguar. esp the latter would show helen that what she's risking for love isnt quite as much as it could be......... :wink:

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mjnet PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 8:24 pm

Janet wrote:
What book does Nikki give Caroline when they are in the library?


I cant remember the book but i remember the look Caroline gave Nikki... she wasnt interested, her mind was on other things...

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Janet PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2005 8:52 pm

Nikki kind of quickly mentions the name..it sounded something like "The Blade" but I don't think that's it. Oh well, thanks

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HelensMy1st PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:28 pm

Having just finished watching Series 3 for the first time, I am currently clinging to every last snippet of Helen and Nikki I can muster before undoubtedly starting from the beginning again and watching out for all the things that have been pointed out to me on this forum - I'm especially interested in finding all the "tongue behind teeth" and "Helen's key chain" shots I can see that I must admit, I had not found as endering until I signed up here!

Anyway, to my point re. Nikki's reading... On the outtakes I have just been watching, Caroline has just wiggled a book at the camera that looks suspiciously like the one Nikki hands to her in their horrible scene (boo! hiss! what'cha doing Nikki?????)... Could be wrong though - I suppose all books look the same really! Anyway, that one's called "More for Timothy" by Victor Gollancz, which appears to be a sequel to "My Dear Timothy" - an autobiographical message to Mr Gollancz's grandson.
:snooze

Well, I did me a bit of Googling and found the following info... "Victor Gollancz (1893-1967) was educated at St. Paul's School and New College, Oxford. Having been judged unfit for foreign service during the First World War, he spent the period teaching at Repton. In 1920 Gollancz began his first job in publishing, working for Benn's publishing house. His own company, Victor Gollancz Ltd, followed in 1928. It was to become one of the most profitable and successful firms in British publishing history. Gollancz's flair for combining political propaganda with successful publishing also found its outlet through his promotion of the Left Book Club. His espousal of other causes, notably pacificism, re-conciliation with Germany and the abolition of capital punishment reflected his own profound religious sense, as did his books My Dear Timothy, More for Timothy, A Year of Grace and From Darkness to Light. In recognition of his help for, and sympathy with, the German people after the war, in 1953 Gollancz was awarded the Grand Cross of the German Order of Merit, and he continued to speak out against anti-German intolerance, most notably with regard to the Eichmann trial in 1961. He was knighted in 1965."

If you're not asleep yet (I didn't understand approx. 30% of the words in that little quote there!), copies are available from Amazon, but I would suspect, like me, "Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit" and "Sophie's World" would be higher on your "must read" list unless you're a real die-hard!!!

Anyhoo, must go now and try and get me a life instead of doing pointless research on the internet!!

Embarassed

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Janet PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:42 am

HelensMy1st

Very impressive. Using several research sources to support and elaborate on your thesis argument and then providing the opportunity for others to continue on investigating the subject. Bravo! You must have been teacher's favorite in school.

I probably won't be reading the book but thank you for the thoroughly researched answer. :D

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HelensMy1st PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 3:43 pm

Thank you Janet.

That's a very nice way of putting it, but essentially you think I'm a geek!

:wink:

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Janet PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 11:07 am

HelensMy1st wrote:

That's a very nice way of putting it, but essentially you think I'm a geek!

:wink:


lol
I can't say for sure if you are or not (although you do seem to display some tendencies) :wink: but as a geek myself, I say, if you are, be proud and embrace your geekness.

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NZ Bad Girl PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 11:09 am

My friends and I are geeks and proud of it.

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I love MJNet PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 12:46 pm

Geeks
Oh I thought you said Greeks........ *goes to put hearing aids back in* Zen moment

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unlikelyheroine PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 12:23 am

Janet wrote:
Nikki kind of quickly mentions the name..it sounded something like "The Blade" but I don't think that's it. Oh well, thanks


I think Nikki says:

"This is the book I was telling you about. The Blake?"

I think she is referring to a book of works by the poet (and artist) William Blake.

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HelensMy1st PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 12:31 am

Re: Geeks
I love MJNet wrote:
Oh I thought you said Greeks........ *goes to put hearing aids back in*


LOL!!! Laughing

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HelensMy1st PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 12:36 am

unlikelyheroine wrote:

I think Nikki says:

"This is the book I was telling you about. The Blake?"

I think she is referring to a book of works by the poet (and artist) William Blake.


Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!! Idea

I think you could be onto something there! The woman who plays Caroline was probably just messing around with "More for Timothy" by Victor Gollancz before filming started! There is every possibility of this given that she is sitting in a library, and thus surrounded by books!!

How glad I am, that I did all that interesting research on Mr Gollancz though :wink:

I read a few William Blake poems in high school though and as I remember they were pretty good and easy to understand... Infinitely better than "More for Timothy", I would wager!

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Janet PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2005 1:00 pm

unlikelyheroine wrote:


I think Nikki says:

"This is the book I was telling you about. The Blake?"

I think she is referring to a book of works by the poet (and artist) William Blake.


Thank you for clearing up that mystery :D

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unlikelyheroine PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 12:07 am

I quite like William Blake myself! : :D

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HelensMy1st PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2005 10:38 pm

Helen&Nikki4ever wrote:
i just bid on 'oranges' on ebay. ive meant to read it for years but never got round to it! so whats sophie's world like? i was thinkin of reading it Wink


Have you read your copy of "Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit" then yet? Because I've just finished mine and although I did an A Level in English Literature (a couple of years ago now :wink: ), I have to say, it totally confused me!!!

What on earth is the "Deuteronomy" chapter on about??? "If you want to keep your own teeth, make your own sandwiches". Okaaaaay....

Bizarre!!! The book started off with such promise, then went a bit weird for my liking. What did you think?

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Helen&Nikki4ever PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 3:32 pm

well i come from a religous background too so i understood that the chapters were like a comparison with the bible books. so it helps to have a basic understanding of what the bible chapters are about and to have experienced fanatical christianity! ill check the teeth bit again and get back to ya! :wink:

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badgirlnuts PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 6:56 pm

Hi there, I got the "Oranges....... from the library and tried to read it but had a difficult time understanding the religious undertones in the novel not being christian and couldn't finish it either, as I just gave up.

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ekny PostPosted: Fri Dec 23, 2005 8:27 pm

Oranges = Rubyfruit
>>Interesting point re Oranges. I had thought at the time that Helen was merely aware of the book's content but you have got me thinking that Helen has read the book before

Hi--I assumed Helen was aware of the book's content in the same way most Americans would be aware of Rubyfruit Jungle--you don't need to have read it to 'know' what it's about. It might now be out of date or irritating to a certain generation of readers, but there was a period of almost 20 years when RJ was pretty much 'the' lesbian book (as I suppose Well of Loneliness was in the 50's). And my impression was that for a certain generation of Brits, Oranges held a similar place in mainstream culture: the first serious, literary lesbian novel in the UK to hit a general audience, be adapted for TV, discussed in classes, etc.

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Helen&Nikki4ever PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 4:32 pm

you're spot on ekney!! i did explain it sumwhere for helensmy1st but in typical fashion for us, in the wrong thread!! Laughing probly in the old muppet wing knowing us! Rolling Eyes

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HelensMy1st PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 4:51 pm

Helen&Nikki4ever wrote:
you're spot on ekney!! i did explain it sumwhere for helensmy1st but in typical fashion for us, in the wrong thread!! Laughing probly in the old muppet wing knowing us! Rolling Eyes

I think it was ever so appropriately in the Monarch of the Glenn thread. Embarassed

Probably shortly after a discussion about whelks and dice.

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ekny PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 7:44 pm

Helen&Nikki4ever wrote:
you're spot on ekney!! i did explain it sumwhere for helensmy1st but in typical fashion for us, in the wrong thread!! :lol: probly in the old muppet wing knowing us! :roll:


hey, fanks! i've been reading to catch up on old threads but haven't tackled the muppet wing yet, waiting til i've more time. happy holidays/nyr's to you & yrs! --cheers, e.

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Helen&Nikki4ever PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2005 7:56 pm

HelensMy1st wrote:
Helen&Nikki4ever wrote:
you're spot on ekney!! i did explain it sumwhere for helensmy1st but in typical fashion for us, in the wrong thread!! Laughing probly in the old muppet wing knowing us! Rolling Eyes

I think it was ever so appropriately in the Monarch of the Glenn thread. Embarassed

Probably shortly after a discussion about whelks and dice.


lol we're good arnt we?! :wink:

ekney, start with the archived muppet wing, then onto the new one. it will all make sense....or not, but thats why we're there! :wink:

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ekny PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 5:32 pm

>>ekney, start with the archived muppet wing, then onto the new one. it will all make sense....or not, but thats why we're there! :wink:

i put off reading the muppet wing threads thinking nah, i don't care so much about an extended discussion of the nutters in the show. straight off i got the rather sly joke, of course, & realized the... the muppet wing was for me. oh dear.

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mandanamad PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2005 5:21 pm

the book
hi i think that wen nikki hands helen the book orenges r not the only fruit i think that helen picks up on the pun that was intended and giggles wen placeing the book bk

belladonnamoonchild PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 6:10 am

Re: the book
mandanamad wrote:
hi i think that wen nikki hands helen the book orenges r not the only fruit i think that helen picks up on the pun that was intended and giggles wen placeing the book bk


That's what I've always thought as well. I love Nikki's body language and facial expressionss in that scene... "the same way ou are, if you are?" Also, I can't help but think the whole reason Helen brings up the topic in the first place, is because she's starting to have questions of her own in that area. Ahem. Wink Sorry that got a bit off-topic. :)

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belladonnamoonchild PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:22 am

Sophie's World - cover designs
Anyone know if copies of Sophie's World, with the same cover designs as our Nikki's, are still available? I have seen some which are similar but not the same. Nikki's face when she saw, "Until we meet on the outside H"... *sigh* :D Awwwh, sooo sweet! :D

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ekny PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 4:40 pm

Re: Sophie's World - cover designs
belladonnamoonchild wrote:
Anyone know if copies of Sophie's World, with the same cover designs as our Nikki's, are still available?


I don't think so. I think the edition you want was printed by Orion, but if you go to their website it's no longer listed.

It's also not listed on Amazon.co.uk, but *is* listed on Amazon.com (US). Their information is often inaccurate--it says it was published in Jan 2005, which is wrong, I'm pretty sure the Orion edition was 1995--but if you check this link it'll at least let you verify visually that this is Helen's hot-pink version:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/185881530...glance&n=283155

The ISBN you want is 1858815304. I think most people here have gotten their copies--if they want Helen's Edition, that is! ;) --on eBay. You can also always check your local bookstores, esp if they have a used section, or ask your local independent bookseller to do a search for you--be sure to specify the edition you're looking for tho! --e

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belladonnamoonchild PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 11:39 pm

Re: Sophie's World - cover designs
ekny wrote:
I don't think so. I think the edition you want was printed by Orion, but if you go to their website it's no longer listed.
It's also not listed on Amazon.co.uk, but *is* listed on Amazon.com (US). Their information is often inaccurate--it says it was published in Jan 2005, which is wrong, I'm pretty sure the Orion edition was 1995


Oh thanks loads for the info! :D I searched both amazons before, but never found the page you did. As for the inaccuracy, yeah, 31 January as the publishing date, 2005, as if! Rolling Eyes

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abzug PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 6:51 pm

I've started musing on this idea of Nikki as a reader. Obviously its a character trait which the show emphasizes from day 1. (OK, maybe day 2.) And I started wondering why that is. At a basic level, they wanted us to know Nikki is intelligent and self-motivated (Middlemarch is not for the faint of heart--took me at least three attempts, and 12 weeks to get through it). And it was a good way to instigate some bonding between Helen and Nikki.

But I also think it has some symbolic meaning as well. Because Nikki is a reader of people as well. Not just individual people, but their relationships, their social structures, their power hierarchies. For instance:

1. Nikki is the only person who knows what is going on between Fenner and Rachel and Fenner and Shell, all without being explicitly told by anyone (unlike, say, Denny, who knows what's going on, but that's because she's Shell's confidant).

2. Nikki correctly interprets Helen's interest in her as a burgeoning sexual attraction, something Helen herself is not even aware of.

3. Nikki is the first one to see through Tessa Spall. Sure, she has more information than anyone else (she did witness the aftermath of Tessa's attack on Shell), but everyone else was blind (I accidentally typed "blond" there--how funny is that?) to the subtle clues that Tessa was giving off.

There's also another layer to this, because Nikki uses the books themselves to assist her in reading/interpreting her circumstances at Larkhall. So its like her reading of literature directly correlates with her reading of people (see below for when we stop seeing Nikki reading any books). There are three books I can think of which are "discussed" in any way (many others are mentioned by name, but with no reference to their topics/themes--which could imply their themes don't matter as much), and all three have specific bearing on Nikki's state of mind and circumstances when she is reading them:

1. Romeo and Juliet: Nikki's only explicit comment is that the heterosexuality of the main characters limits her interest in the play. But as Nikki's interest in Helen is already growing, it makes sense that she would seek out this story of star-crossed lovers, who are members of opposing "families."

2. Little Dorrit: N: Its a book about a terrible prison. H: Thank goodness we got rid of all of those. OK, I haven't read this one, but doing a bit of research on Amazon, one reviewer says "The novel is about all sorts of imprisonment: physical, mental, spiritual" which obviously applies to Nikki's situation. There's also a ton about class issues (the main characters are in debtor's prison) and a general sense of injustice about who winds up in prison and who doesn't. Again, all themes which would hit home for Nikki, and provide her with some insight/perspective.

3. Portrait of a Lady: Helen says "That's heavy going for a no-hoper like you." I did read this novel--the only American one in the bunch, I think!--but it was over 10 years ago, and I remember nothing about it (sad!). However, following some quickie research, I'm thinking Isabel Archer (the heroine) is a bit of a Helen-type, spurning romance to pursue her own independent life, who then winds up making an unfortunate and unhappy choice for marriage. Interesting reading, Nikki!

Which brings us all to the important point about Nikki being a reader, which is that sometimes she is a very bad reader. Even with all these works of great literature to assist her! Most notably in her jealousy of Helen and Dominic, which is where it gets her into the most trouble. But also in her not seeing through Caroline's interest in her. These moments are notable because they are so un-Nikki-like. In the end, all these "bad reader" moments have to do with her relationship with Helen. In fact, I can't think of a moment when we see her reading after she and Helen become involved at Larkhall in S2E6. Its almost proving that old adage, love is blind. Or in this case, makes you blind. At least, when you're locked up in jail and have no control or autonomy. Smile

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BillyNoMates PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:03 pm

Very interesting, abzug. I never thought about a correlation between Nikki reading both books and people. Do ya think her short-sightedness with people(well, Helen mostly)is a consequence of having to change her point of view? When we read a book, we get to take a more omniscient and removed view - things that aren't necessarily known to a specific character are known to us and, all suspense aside, we usually stay one step ahead of the book's subjects. When you deal with real people, however, you don't get that luxury. I think one of Nikki's problems is she enjoys that all-knowing position a little too much.
The bust-up about Dominic is a good example. She knows that Helen is friendly with Dominic, that they've spoken outside of work. She knows that he has a crush on Helen. She knows that Dominic was at Helen's flat, and that's all she knows. In order to deal with all that, Nikki has to take her very limited knowledge and process it as best she can. We all know how that turns out.
To end my rambling, I think that Nikki can be a very good judge of a situation when she's given as much information as possible, i.e when her point of view is much closer to that of a passive reader. When it isn't, and when her emotional investment is high enough, she mucks it up.

Little Dorrit is sitting on my shelf right now, and as soon as I finish The Turn of the Screw, I think read it next to see how it might tie into your idea.

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ekny PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:19 pm

abzug wrote:
Which brings us all to the important point about Nikki being a reader, which is that sometimes she is a very bad reader. Even with all these works of great literature to assist her! Most notably in her jealousy of Helen and Dominic, which is where it gets her into the most trouble. But also in her not seeing through Caroline's interest in her. These moments are notable because they are so un-Nikki-like. In the end, all these "bad reader" moments have to do with her relationship with Helen.


Hi Abzug, I think these are big issues you've raised & am not quite done thinking about them (have been doing so for some time now), so first must apologize for an unfinished post but felt this was too important not to comment on.


1) For myself, I think it's necessary to maintain a distinction between literal reading & metaphorical reading. ymmv, as They say.

2) Speaking literally: I am not sure I agree that Nikki's a bad reader at all. She's intelligent, highly motivated, & is chomping down those big victorian potboilers for some of the most basic reasons anyone picks up a book. If one of the core motivations behind reading is pleasure, then Nikki's as good a reader as any, & probably better than most.

Nikki's unschooled, which is a different matter. She has almost no formal training; that's not to slight her. She's bright enough to get whatever she gets from those books, like everyone else in her shoes--but there are places her understanding will be unstructured. Given who Nikki is, where she is, and her penchant for romantic excess, for me that is significant in itself.

Iow, it could also be argued that without formal training, it's easier for someone like Nikki to take away from a text what she chooses, without being a little more pushed to answer questions she might not think up on her own. Again--this is exactly like all of us, it's one of the things that justifies the pain & misery of higher education, eh? Nikki hasn't had this chance yet, that's all.

3) Am v reluctantly not addressing the metaphorical issues at the moment, I'd go on for ages. Pages. Whatever.

--cheers,
e

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ekny PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:29 pm

BillyNoMates wrote:
Do ya think her short-sightedness with people(well, Helen mostly)is a consequence of having to change her point of view? When we read a book, we get to take a more omniscient and removed view - things that aren't necessarily known to a specific character are known to us and, all suspense aside, we usually stay one step ahead of the book's subjects. When you deal with real people, however, you don't get that luxury. I think one of Nikki's problems is she enjoys that all-knowing position a little too much.


Oh that's cracking, yes! Your summary of how we read traditional types of narrative--all Nikki's books *are* traditional & I think it's a distinction worth keeping in mind--is very good, and it underlines something I was trying to get at in my post w/o quite finishing the thought: that Nikki misreads Helen because she's a bit too *good* a reader, not because she's a bad or sloppy one. It's her impulsiveness & tendency to arrive at instant conclusions and not second-guess herself that gets in her way: when her perceptions aren't accurate, she hasn't learned how to give herself a way out.

BillyNoMates wrote:
I think that Nikki can be a very good judge of a situation when she's given as much information as possible, i.e when her point of view is much closer to that of a passive reader. When it isn't, and when her emotional investment is high enough, she mucks it up.


Bang on, I think. Thanks! --e

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abzug PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:29 pm

BillyNoMates wrote:
To end my rambling, I think that Nikki can be a very good judge of a situation when she's given as much information as possible, i.e when her point of view is much closer to that of a passive reader.

As ekny already said, excellent observation! I think this is spot on. And also the point about Nikki always reading traditional narratives with reliable narrators (as opposed to some post-modern bizarro stuff).

ekny wrote:
that Nikki misreads Helen because she's a bit too *good* a reader, not because she's a bad or sloppy one.

Yes, excellent, I totally agree.

Just wanted to clarify a few things....

ekny wrote:
2) Speaking literally: I am not sure I agree that Nikki's a bad reader at all.

Oh, no--I hope my post didn't imply that I thought Nikki was a bad reader, particularly when we're talking about the literal, not metaphorical reading. All I wanted to point out with regards to her "mis-reading" is that (a) at some point mid-season 2 we stop seeing her read books and (B) the timing of that at least somewhat corresponds with her lapses in her ability to "read" people. And that it all might have something to do with her feelings for Helen.

Quote:
She's bright enough to get whatever she gets from those books, like everyone else in her shoes--but there are places her understanding will be unstructured.

Definitely, which is why I got intrigued and started speculating on what, exactly, she IS getting from reading these books.

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mandanamad PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 8:57 pm

ya i think helen asks nikki the question of " how can u be sure" bcoz she is starting 2 question her own sexuality and just wants 2 know from some 1 who has already come out how they can be certain

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GeauxGurl PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:41 am

abzug wrote:
Oh, no--I hope my post didn't imply that I thought Nikki was a bad reader, particularly when we're talking about the literal, not metaphorical reading. All I wanted to point out with regards to her "mis-reading" is that (a) at some point mid-season 2 we stop seeing her read books and (B) the timing of that at least somewhat corresponds with her lapses in her ability to "read" people. And that it all might have something to do with her feelings for Helen.


Well, remember too that Nikki is now taking classes. She does still read, but she is now having to read what is required for her classes, and probably doesn't have the time to read "for pleasure" like she used to have. I do believe that her feelings for Helen are also consuming her, and therefore affecting her ability to "read" people. Actually, I believe that it is probably a combination of the two things ~ her studies and Helen ~ These two things are keeping her mind occupied. She simply doesn't have the time, nor probably the interest, to be able to "sit back and observe" like she used to. She's got more important things on her mind, now. (Also, her appeal.) She is allowing her "emotions" to control, (hince the whole Helen /Dominic mess), when she used to be more "thoughtful". Does this make sense?? Rolling Eyes
Also, what is everyone's take on the significance of "Sophie's World"?? Being that it is Helen who has read it, and gives it to Nikki to read ~~ why? Just for intertaining reading, or is there deeper meaning behind it?? Or is this just meant to be a symbol of the "unity" that Helen & Nikki seem to experience ~ something that they "share"?? Shocked

I'm really enjoying reading everyone's posts on this subject!!! Very Happy

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ekny PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 4:18 am

abzug wrote:
All I wanted to point out with regards to her "mis-reading" is that (a) at some point mid-season 2 we stop seeing her read books and (B) the timing of that at least somewhat corresponds with her lapses in her ability to "read" people. And that it all might have something to do with her feelings for Helen.


I'm not sure, have been thinking about it & of course would have to review the whole lot with this question in mind, more's the pity. But I suspect if we just look to Nikki for *reaction* shots--and there are a lot of them, all through--we'd see that the direction almost always presents her, in that way, as a highly reliable reader/interpreter of her environment. When Nikki's amused (and she frequently is) by the goings on around her, we're intended to be so; when she's annoyed or concerned, ditto. (This is not to argue at all with the idea that she gets things wrong, frequently, on the subject of Helen. The ideas are not mutually exclusive.)--e

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Toni~girl PostPosted: Sat Mar 11, 2006 7:20 am

I think initially Nikki has been stripped of the ability to control her emotions from the start. Definately having experienced what she did with Trish, being locked away from the only life/family that she knew, not having any sort of clear vision of when she may released, Fenner's abuse, Shell Dockley's crap, being everyone's "go to person" when they are in trouble (sort of a "nevermind what's bugging you Nik, I need your help" type of thing), Helen's on again, off again attitude, everyday having to tell someone that she's "a miscarriage of justice", emotional strain of just not being able to be with the one person she loves more than anyone, and being the ever "forgiver" no matter what certain people did. Hell, I'd be quite moody myself!

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Toni~girl PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 9:15 pm

I was only able to find these covers.

***ekny ETA:
[partially managed re-upload, too time-consuming to do all 3, sorry: the Sophie's World cover, since out of print & the hardest image to find, seemed most important to save. --ek 6/1/6] ***

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GeauxGurl PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 5:01 am

Toni~girl wrote:
I was only able to find these covers.


Kewl!! Thanks for postin' 'em ~~ I was lucky enough to be able to obtain my very own "hot pink" copy ~ and for a fantastic deal!!!! I haven't had a chance to even think about some of the others, yet .....

GG

Toni~girl PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 7:51 pm

You are quite welcome! Wink
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aquarius68 PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:43 am

BOOKS NIKKI READ WHILST IN PRISION
I have another book to add to the list.
In S2 Ep12, Nikki picks up the book "To the Lighthouse"
by Virginia Woolf. She starts to read it, just before Dom
enters the cell for that chat. I only noticed this a few days
ago - just thought I'll let you know.

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ekny PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:40 am

Re: BOOKS NIKKI READ WHILST IN PRISION
aquarius68 wrote:
I have another book to add to the list. In S2 Ep12, Nikki picks up the book "To the Lighthouse" by Virginia Woolf. She starts to read it, just before Dom enters the cell for that chat. I only noticed this a few days ago - just thought I'll let you know.


*Nice* one! I could never make that title out, my tv's too small. Since yours obviously isn't, I'm hoping you or someone else can help me with another: when Shell's hand goes to sweep Nikki's books onto the floor before setting fire to her cell, there's a very brief shot of them, just a second or two. On the end is a title about prison-related stuff (I can't recall what it is at the moment): next to it is a Wodehouse book. Which one is it?

(I always thought this might be a tiny shout-out/nod in the general direction of Cazalet, who was a relative of his, as I understand it--great-great-grand-neice or -daughter, something like that.)

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Just Another Mad Bad Fan PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:46 pm

Book Nikki Read Whilst In Prison
The Wodehouse was the autobiographical "Performing Flea". Cazalet is his great-granddaughter I think. Bizarrely another one of those books which Shell swept off the shelf was "Police & People In London. IV. The Police In Action" !

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ekny PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:08 pm

Re: Book Nikki Read Whilst In Prison
Just Another Mad Bad Fan wrote:
The Wodehouse was the autobiographical "Performing Flea". Cazalet is his great-granddaughter I think. Bizarrely another one of those books which Shell swept off the shelf was "Police & People In London. IV. The Police In Action" !


Excellent, many thanks! Yep, dem's the ones. Sheesh--were you just sitting on this Valuable info, hoarding it for a rainy day or what? How'd you pull it up that fast?! Is your tv that much better than mine? Despair.

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Just Another Mad Bad Fan PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:40 am

Books Nikki Read Whilst In Prison
Laughing No ekny, nothing like that! I just happened to have spotted that one myself and made a note of it - must have been mental telepathy across the cyberverse or something! But I was intrigued by the police book and wondered if it was perhaps a blooper to have it on Nikki's bookshelf, or if the implication is that she is reading up on the police and their responsibilities, for her appeal. But without knowing the content of the book, there is no way of knowing whether this is a possibility or not. The book is authored by David J. Smith & Jeremy Gray and is published by the Policy Studies Institute.

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ekny PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 3:17 pm

Just Another Mad Bad Fan wrote:
I was intrigued by the police book and wondered if it was perhaps a blooper to have it on Nikki's bookshelf, or if the implication is that she is reading up on the police and their responsibilities, for her appeal.


She might also just be reading up as a general point of interest. I agree it's likely just a prop w/o too much thought behind it, but by good luck or intent, that title in the series is much more appropriate to N's interest than others.

Just Another Mad Bad Fan wrote:
But without knowing the content of the book, there is no way of knowing whether this is a possibility or not. The book is authored by David J. Smith & Jeremy Gray and is published by the Policy Studies Institute.


1983. I would think the types of reading material permitted to prisoners is the sort of detail they'd have discussed with Tchaikovsky at some point, & also where props could obtain it.

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Just Another Mad Bad Fan PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 10:39 pm

Books Nikki Read Whilst In Prison
I meant, is the content of the book such, that it is a possibility that it would have been useful reading for her appeal, not would she have been permitted to read it! Sorry! I put it rather ambiguously!

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ekny PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 10:58 pm

Just Another Mad Bad Fan wrote:
I meant, is the content of the book such, that it is a possibility that it would have been useful reading for her appeal, not would she have been permitted to read it! Sorry! I put it rather ambiguously!


That's funny, that's exactly what I assumed you meant, but something in my reply made you think I was questioning whether she'd be allowed such material! And here we were understanding each other so well before we started explaining ourselves. ;)

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Just Another Mad Bad Fan PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 11:24 pm

Books Nikki Read Whilst In Prison
Ain't got no mental telepathy now 'ave I? Laughing

BOOKS NIKKI READ WHILE IN PRISION

I have discovered another book to add to the list.
In "Shit Happens" episode, when Jim searches
Nikki's cell, on the desk their is a copy of "The Ambassadors"
by Henry James.

Hi, yes that was mentioned above--although I think it was also you who first mentioned To the Lighthouse, that's still posted above too! :)

To summarize so everyone doesn't have to reread the previous entries if they don't want to, here's my list so far. If anyone knows specific episode numbers for the ones I haven't cited--or has new H/N titles to add that we missed--please post them here! (or PM me so I can edit/correct this post.) Thank you. --e

(I stopped w/anything like Macbeth that was, far as I could tell, peripheral at best to H/N... otherwise we'd include all book references for every character, which might be someone else's fun project but. I just don't think it's especially Meaningful that Yvonne reads Danielle Steele--the book's literally just a prop, there, & has nowt to do with H/N.)


Sophie's World - Jostein Gardner

Romeo and Juliet (S1ep6)
Oranges Are Not The Only Fruit - Jeanette Winterson (S1ep6)
Great Love Poems - ed. Shane Weller (S1 ep7, 24.22)
Little Dorrit - Charles Dickens (S1 Ep9)
The Ambassadors - Henry James (S2ep2?)
("spine visible when Fenner starts picking up Nikki's books & chucking them around" unlikelyheroine, Feb 2005)
To the Lighthouse - Virginia Woolf (S2 ep12, just before Dom enters cell)
Middlemarch - George Eliot
Silas Marner - George Eliot
The Aspern Papers & The Turn of the Screw - Henry James
The Portrait of a Lady - Henry James

minor titles
(glancing background shots--there may be more of these not yet added.*)

Performing Flea - P.G. Wodehouse (autobio) (Shell sweeping N's books to the floor S3ep6 12.11)
Police & People In London. IV. The Police In Action - David J. Smith & Jeremy Gray, Policy Studies Institute, 1983.

[Wm Blake (Caroline to N in lib)]
Macbeth (2 Julies/Monica)

-----
* For ex in various lib scenes--though many are doubtless unimportant & others aren't 'books' at all: among the latter sort of observation would be JAMBF's [I *think* it was her!] brilliant reading of the (literal) sign behind Helen during The Library Scene (S1ep6 40.13-15), which reads "Geography" being a very apt metaphor for H's changing internal topography. Strictly speaking that kind of thing doesn't belong in a list of books but it was so perfect I just had to mention it again until we start a thread on reading background. ;) )

Hi all,

I'm so glad to see this thread and know that I'm not the only one whose summer reading is based on the predilections of a fictional character. :) I posted originally under the "Freedom" section on this message board, so I'll try not to repeat myself too much.

But, I'm about to go on a little tangent, so before that happens, I want to add to the list:

"Great Love Poems"--edited by Shane Weller.

This is in series 1, episode 7 (at time code 00:24:22 for the region 2 PAL version to be completely geeky). Shell taunts Nikki about it and asks "What's in it? Lesbi love poems?," and then proceeds to pour cola on the notebook on Nikki's side table.

Did anyone else see the really good interview with Jeanette Winterson last week on American Public Television? I think it was on Saturday night; I was so impressed with her I finally got around to "Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit" the next day. Our dear public library had a copy and there went my Sunday. The character of Nikki is seems influenced by the book. The main character in the novel also leaves home at 16 under pressure regarding her lesbian behaviour. She is also a very charasmatic and persuasive speaker to a large group of people.

I felt like the characterisation of this work as a "lesbian" book that I've heard for several years was a little overstated, though. The main character could have done nearly the same thing with a young man and possibly had a similar result. The book is more about being a foriegner, learning about the fallibility of adults, making peace with expectations, and using creative outlets as a coping mechanism than it is about being gay. When I get through the Nikki Wade list, I'm definitely going to look into some of Jeanette Winterson's later work. Even though the structure felt a little choppy to me at times, she is clearly intelligent. The writing in this novel is a little better than "Rubyfruit Jungle" though, IMHO (although that one is worth reading as well and is a little more about actually being gay). I hope I don't get mobbed; my sister lives in the same town as author to that one. :huh:

Cheers,
F

Back many years ago I stumbled upon a book of short stories called "Tasting Life Twice: Literary Lesbian Fiction by New American Writers." One of the things the editor focused on in her introduction and in her selection of stories for the book was that the subjects the authors addressed were often not those traditional "lesbian" stories that we are accustomed to. (Ie, sexual awakening, coming out romances etc) Part of what made her classify these stories as "literary" was that they took on broader themes and interwove them with a lesbian sensibility or perspective, rather than simply creating plots that were explicitly lesbian.

I mention this book because I think "Oranges Are Not the Only Fruit" falls into this category of literature which has a lesbian perspective, where a lesbian point of view pervades every theme and every plot point, but where many many different ideas are addressed that aren't just about being a lesbian. The editor of "Tasting Life Twice" was essentially trying to broaden the definition of what we consider to be "lesbian" literature, so that it could include a wide variety of stories, characters themes etc.

To bring in our favorite tv show as another example, many people would not consider BG to be a "lesbian" program--they would save that label for a show like "The L Word" or for a film like "Dessert Hearts" (or "Incredibly True Adventures" or "Fucking Amal" or "Aimee and Jaguar" or--wow, the list has become too long to name every one!). These are all shows/films which have only lesbian characters at their center, which focus entirely (or nearly entirely) on lesbian storylines (ie romance, coming out, or both). But I do consider BG to be a "lesbian" television program, even now when Helen and Nikki aren't at the core of the show. Of course BG has much broader concerns, but I think a lesbian perspective defines every topic the show tackles, particularly in its focus on power hierarchies and oppression of women by men. In fact, I think BG's focus on these themes actually makes it MORE of a "lesbian" show than "The L Word" which seems to ignore the fact that lesbians are actually oppressed in our society by focusing on characters who are rich, feminine, and have every opportunity open to them.

Hi Azbug,

Thanks for the info. re: "Tasting Life Twice"; I'll see if I can dig it up at the library.

I'm with you absolutely on that every lesbian character should be something beyond her sexuality. BG themselves did a great job with that in regards to the S1 PO character Lorna Rose. Although she is a lesbian, her prision career ambitions, navieté, and carelessness are the characteristics that define her role within the story. Her lesbianism is only revealed via locker pictures, a snide comment from Shell, and the character bio on the website.

The problem is that categorizing works as specifically "lesbian" often has the effect of reducing their perceived universality. For example, Milan Kundera's books are not classified as "heterosexual interest" even though the author and all the characters in them are essentially heterosexual (although in one there is a bit about a woman who had a crush on her female 1st grade teacher, but it's treated as a passing childhood fancy). In "Oranges Are Not The Only Fruit", the main character herself doesn't have lesbian feelings until the last third of the book, and the nature of the relationships themselves has relatively few details. The theme is that this child must do something hugely disappointing to her parents as part of her growing up. This book has value on its own as literature, even without the "lesbian" categorisation. I'd be the first to put this book on a list of the lesbian-related literary canon. But, to label it specifically as a "lesbian" book implies to me that it doesn't have the basic literary value that books that books without lesbian characters have.

And don't get me started on the L-Word. :)

Truth is, I'm thankful for all of it. When I first saw two women kiss on television in 1991 I never imagined we have so much to debate about.

Jesus Christos I need to get back to work.

Cheers,
F

Hi, I agree with many aspects of your post, but must disagree with this one. Unless lesbians write better literature--and pay good money to read it--we've got no one but ourselves to blame for most of it being beach-reads, nothing more. But that doesn't mean the category has no inherent value. Sarah Waters is the blazingly obvious example of a perfect cross-over writer, who doesn't sacrifice anything in the way of lesbian sensibility or sexuality yet has still aquired a large reading audience, etc., simply because she's such an irresistibly good story-teller. Obviously if there were 10 of her I'd be a happier pup, but I can't tell you how many little baby dykes have trotted through the bookstore in the last decade saying things like "Oh, if I want to read literature I read stuff by gay men."

Fabulous, this is what queer studies has done for us? I'm so not impressed. --e

Azbug, no worries, I disagree with lots of people, I'm still glad you are around and doing this MB! It's always a little painful to see one of my typos reproduced in quotes, though. I knew I was tired.

So, while we are in disagreement on one issue, I might as well press my luck and talk about another part of your post.

and

That is a little surprising. I feel like the body of gay man's literature has at least as much of the dime store novel variety than the stuff from the girls, particularly in modern times. Historically, of course there are all sorts of reasons women are less represented as writers. Sarah Waters, Jeanette Winterson, Rita Mae Brown's only good novel, Alice B. Toklas, Leslie Feinberg, some would include Virginia Woolf, arguably the book of Ruth in the bible ;)...it's not *too* shabby.

Anyway, I'm anxiously awaiting the Nikki-based reading list books to come in. I'm 1.5 down and around 10.5 to go.

Cheers,
F

Er, I mean, Ekny.

:err

Oh, Oh, Oh!

I found another one not on the list, which means I'm now going to read it. "Women in Love" by D.H. Lawrence. This one is on the table in S3E15 (the last N+H episode) when Di is searching Nikki's cell. I had to use the cover art plus the author's name that I could just make out in one of the frames.

Goddess bless Amazon.

Cheers,
F

Flutur Posted on Jul 11 2006, 04:30 AM
[QUOTE]Did anyone else see the really good interview with Jeanette Winterson last week on American Public Television?

Hi, I did see the interview on Bill Moyers and like you was very struck by her eloquence. She articulated her reasoning of greek mythology very knowledgebly on Hercules and Atlas which her latest book 'Weight' is about. She comes across as a very down to earth person that one could listen to for a longtime and not get bored. Now I'm embarassed that I actually abandoned 'Oranges......... half way through.

Does anyone know the name of the book Nikki is reading in the "Oh What a Night" ep, when Jim locks Nikki's & Bab's cell. My TV isn't big enough to work out the title.

[QUOTE=badgirlnuts,Jul 21 2006, 05:16 PM] Flutur Posted on Jul 11 2006, 04:30 AM
[QUOTE]Did anyone else see the really good interview with Jeanette Winterson last week on American Public Television?

Hi, I did see the interview on Bill Moyers and like you was very struck by her eloquence. She articulated her reasoning of greek mythology very knowledgebly on Hercules and Atlas which her latest book 'Weight' is about. She comes across as a very down to earth person that one could listen to for a longtime and not get bored. Now I'm embarassed that I actually abandoned 'Oranges......... half way through. [/QUOTE]
Obviously, I don't know about your reasons for abandoning 'Oranges', but I've known people who've done exactly the same. Of my 'gay' friends (ooooh, I hate saying that!), around half of them express no interest in reading it, whilst the other half have either given up halfway through or been disappointed on finishing it. I think labelling books as 'lesbian' is problematic. As a young lesbian, I want to read books where I can see reflections of myself and feels sympathy and emphathy for the characters. But at the same time, I don't like feeling that I only read 'lesbian' books, and not literature which is considered 'quality' in the mainstream. I like Sarah Waters, as, with the exception of Tipping the Velvet, the lesbian relationships are less prominant- always there, but not having a huge amount of attention drawn to the fact that they are lesbian.

Anywayz, that's neither here nor there really :S

I've always seen the 'Oranges' scene in the library as a reflection of Helen as opposed to Nikki, though there are undoubtly parallels in the main character's life and Nikki's. I think it's the religious element of it which makes me think of Helen. With her father's occupation, I've always assumed she had a fairly strict, religious upbringing, which she rejects, in a similar way to the girl in 'Oranges'. However, unlike the book, it takes her more time to break away from that and admit her feelings for Nikki. I dunno, just a thought. *shrug*

I'd love to know what anyone makes of 'Sophie's World' and it's relation to Helen and Nikki. I haven't finished reading it yet, but I did find something interesting whilst I was reading it the other day. One of the chapters (page 129 in my copy) is called "The Postcards", with the sub-title of "I'm imposing a severe censorship on myself", which I think reflects hugely on Helen writing to Nikki, both in what she could say which Nikki would understand but couldn't be understood if intercepted, and also on what she feels she is able to say to Nikki, what she herself is ready for. *SPOILER-ISH IF YOU HAVEN'T READ IT* In the middle of that chapter (page 133 in my copy), Hilde's father says that he is sending her postcards via Sophie, which reminded me of the situation where Barbara offers to have Helen send Nikki's letters to her, so they are intercepted.

Again, just ideas. :)

Hi Kirsty, Here's what i wrote regarding "Oranges.......

badgirlnuts PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 6:56 pm

Hi there, I got the "Oranges....... from the library and tried to read it but had a difficult time understanding the religious undertones in the novel not being christian and couldn't finish it either, as I just gave up.

Well, I clearly wasn't intelligent enough to find that :P Thank you :)
I suppose I'm on the Agnostic/Atheist borderline myself, so I don't know a lot about religion from my day-to-day experiences, but I loved GCSE RS and had a tiny, awesome class so I got a lot out of that which I think aided my understanding of it. I'd say give it another try, if you've got the time or the inclination :lol:

I haven't read Sophie's World, but I think you are on the right track with the kinds of connections you are making between some of the imagery in the novel and the imagery on the show. The stuff you've mentioned is similar to some of the associations people have made between BG and Middlemarch and Romeo & Juliet, which along with Sophie's World are probably the three most emphasized literary allusions on the show. Anyway, I'd love to hear more of the connections you see between SW and BG, as would lots of the other folks on the board. :D

I just rewatched the 6 pt. BBC adaptation of "Middlemarch" and one moment that struck me...that I felt Nikki reading in her cell might've taken a breather to reflect upon was this little exchange between Ladislaw, the hero rebel of the piece who is in love with Dorothea, the married heroine, proper and living by the rules, tho a would-be reformer and do-gooder.

L: I suppose one gets a habit of doing without happiness or hope... What I care for more than I can ever care for anything else is absolutely forbidden me.

D: I have never done you any injustice. Please remember me.

L: How can you say that? As if I were not in danger of forgetting everything else.

I've checked it against the novel, and the dialogue is almost verbatim.

And from the novel itself:

She was ready to say that it was as hard on her as on him, and that she was helpless; but those strange particulars of their relation which neither of them could explicitly mention kept her always in dread of saying too much.

Nice.

Hi Kirsty,

I hadn't thought about that, but I like your comparison. I am about halfway through this one as well (I've gotten a bit distracted from the Nikki Wade reading list by a grammar book and a travel book...but I'm finishing those and coming back).

For me, Sophie's World is ideal for Nikki and Helen because it is a novel about the ideas, or the importance of using thought to discover something beyond one's immediate situation. Often the analogy is made in the novel between most of mankind dwelling down in the fur of a rabbit while the philosophers want to crawl to the edges of the fur and see what is outside. Nikki refers to her mind as being free and the only thing Fenner/the prison can't get at. Helen understood Nikki well enough to intuit that. Being an observant woman herself who enjoyed just such a contemplative book, Helen figured it would be just the thing to endear the highly intelligent Nikki Wade to her...even if it worked a little better than she intended.

Cheers,
Flutur

I had a thought about Middlemarch, while watching the BBC adaptation of another Eliot novel, Daniel Deronda. I've never read DD, and it's been a while since I read MM, but there did seem to me to be a common theme of Eliot heroines getting into bad marriages because it's the right thing to do. Which strikes me as very Helen-like, in terms of her relationship with Sean.

Then I asked myself, why do I assume that the MM reference has to be about Helen? I mean, Nikki is the one who's reading the novel, after all. But then I was thinking, well, Nikki reads a lot of things which aren't exactly her cup of tea, right? She reads them because there IS no "Juliet and Juliet" out there for her to read. So she reads the classics, and in her head she makes the changes she needs to in the story so that it becomes her cup of tea.

Which is, in terms of real life, consistent with lesbian reading practices. :)

Indeed! And one other Eliot thought, which is that her heroines (at least the moral ones) after making the bad marriage decision, tend to find a way to wind up with their correct match, the person who isn't appropriate, but who they love.

oh groooan! I'm really gonna have to read more of her, ain't I?! GROAN. Please miss, I'll take all me medications, I'll be very quiet & ever so good...

Well well well.

Sorry, couldn't resist. All credit for this highly intelligent bit of guesswork goes to JAMBF; we were talking & wondering, again, what book Nikki was reading before her escape in ep 2.13.

It's the Well of Loneliness. No kidding.

When I asked her how on earth she came up with the idea or matched the covers, she replied:

We had a bit of a time finding the exact match for the cover--the current Virago edition has the cover shot reversed from the cover we see in Bad Girls, but it turns out the older (green-spined) Virago edition which would have been in print at the time is the exact match.

So how's about them apples!!! :)


Cover art is from 'Le Amiche' (1924) by Ubaldo Oppi ('The Friends').


current (2008) incarnation of Virago cover:




older ('green spine') Virago cover:




When things got difficult, Nikki turned to her bible...




(book shot, rotated):




'Le Amiche' (1924), Ubaldo Oppi:

Oh. My. God.

First of all, you guys are crazy. Second of all, thank god you are, because this is the most delicious find, of all the what-is-Nikki-reading musings! I am enamored of this. Someone should write a thank you note to the set dresser, or whoever it was who decided what Nikki should be reading in various scenes.

WOW WOW WOW!!!

THAT IS FABULOUS!!!!

I'm hopping up and down here.

I love you guys.

:giveheart

That's brilliant that is.

And it so figures.

JAMBF...you are another mad bad fan!! But hardly just another. Have a pint on me. :drinkies

And that cover is Sooooo Wayyy much better than the dreadful posed cover on my 70s era paperback copy using...live models. *choke* Done up as someone's very bad idea of lesbians of the era.

Now, I must find a copy of that edition.

Oh Nikki. I want to hug her all the more now. :prisonbars

Delicious find is right, Abzug.

You guys are real fanatics, just like me when I first discovered this series. Wonder how the US BG will be like when it airs.

Ahem! Well in that regard I think we are perhaps in quite good company on this board! After all, I seem to recall that there was one crazy person who actually sat down and worked out a Timeline for the show! And there was another one who flew across the Atlantic not once, but twice to see Bad Girls The Musical...Oh no hang on - come to think of it, that was one and the same person. So clearly we're dealing with a fairly high level of craziness here! :lol:

That wouldn't by any chance be this rather dodgy one would it Jeanna?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9...Pocket_1974.jpg
The woman in front reminds me a little of Trisha! :eek
Oh, and thanks for the pint! :)

:eek That's the one!

I've always been embarrassed to have it on my bookshelves--and not for the subject matter.

I suppose it does rather give a whole new meaning to the term "Lipstick Lesbian" - those ones must surely be "The Whole Bloody Make-up bag Lesbians"! :rolleyes:

You're right, she does look a bit like Trish.