Hi !

I'm a new vampire player. I've been playing my dark elves for 6 months, and have had disappointing results so far (5 victories, 7 losses, and the victories are against the same O&G opponent, someone who doesn't aim for victory himself). I'll continue playing my elves, but i'd like to try a new army, and for that, i wanted to continue on the magic heavy field. Tzeench tempted me a little, but raising the dead is just (Y)

So i want to start a necrarch army. In order to begin, i'd like an army list to begin with, so as to buy the models. Here's my army list.

Note : I'm french, the unit/items/character names may be incorrect, but i hope it won't be to hard to understand anyway.

2000 points necrarch :

310 - Master necromancer, level 4, spell familiar, Wristbands of Black Gold, Cloak of Mist & Shadows
135 - Wraith, Obsidian amulet
150 - Necromancer, level 2, powerstone, book of Archan
140 - Necromancer, level 2, staff of Damnation

185 - 20 skeletons, full command
185 - 20 skeletons, full command
130 - 20 zombies, musician, standard
40 - 5 ghouls
50 - 5 wolves
50 - 5 wolves

130 - 2 Spirit hosts
130 - 10 Grave guards, shields
130 - 10 Grave guards, shields
125 - 5 Black knights, horse armor

90 - Banshee

I intend to get a versatile army that says "Oh my god no more magic please !"

The 3 necromancers will go into the 3 undead blocks. They will act as anvils and as protection. From there, my hammers will be the knights and the grave guards, using my superior magic to summon other anvils where i need them, or screens to protect my most precious troops. The wraith (the ethereal guy with the scythe, right ?) will act as a hunter on his own going for warmachines and lone characters, immune to arrows and with a 3+ ward save against anything that hits ethereal undeads.

I'm not sure i need to make my grave guards and black knights more deadly with command models, as they're here to bring dynamic CR (casualties). I'm not sure either about the use of the wraith and/or the master necromancer. Isn't it better to use vampires somewhere in there ?

I'm welcoming any comment. Except "Your list suxx".

PS : in the name of Malekith, are the vampire counts items good ! The druchii items pale in comparison.

This isn't a Necrarch army. Please post in the correct forum.

Your army may say

, but it also says "Ooh. No difficult targets."

Your 5 black knights, lacking any command will be destroyed by enemies half their cost, and your ten-strong grave guard are as good as worthless.

The banshee is incredibly vulnerable, and any enemy with a magic weapon will immediately engage your master necromancer and kill him.

Game over.

Alright its not that great in my opinion although some parts of this list are good. first you say that it is a necrarch army list but there isn't any vampires in this what so ever so it isn't a necrarch army!!!
Also the grave guard units are way to small group them together for one nice big unit.
Why does your Master Necrommancer need the wrist band of black gold? If he is going to stay in a unit there is no need for this what so ever.
There is no point in taking these black knight because there is nothing that they can do.
Instead of giving your wraith the obsedian amulet give him the cursed book.

Comments noted. I didn't know that the bloodline affected only the vampires. I'll include one in my list to make use of the necrarch powers. Here we go :

330 - Vampire count necrarch (general), level 2, Unholy sword, Ring of the night (ward save 5+), dark acolyte
140 - Necromancer, level 2, book of Arkhan, spell familiar
140 - Necromancer, level 2, Staff of damnation
115 - Necromancer, level 2, Black periapt

50 - 5 wolves
50 - 5 wolves
40 - 5 ghouls
40 - 5 ghouls
185 - 20 skeletons, full command
185 - 20 skeletons, full command
145 - 15 skeletons, full command

65 - 1 spirit host
199 - 6 black knights, musician, standard, warbanner
309 - 18 grave guards, full command, banner of barrows (hit on 3+)

Like this, it's a nercrach army with lots of magic. I have two strong units (grave guards and black knights) than can deal serious wounds.

I'm still welcoming any comments :)

This list is much better (Y) . However on your count i would instead give your count unholy counsure and the noble blood and instead drop unholy sword and the ring of the night because i he is in a unit he shouldn't be targetted that much. Also drop the spirt host one on its own is not enough. So IMHO go with 3 or none

I can understand why the sword would be gone, but why drop the ward save ? That vampire is my general, and i don't feel comfortable having her with only her toughness and her unit to protect her. Is it this good a protection ?

Also, is Unholy Cyonosure the blood power that allows to reroll one dice in a magic phase (unsure because i am french) ? Is it that good a power ?

It means that you can re-roll any dice that could be to cause an irresistiable force or PREVENT a miscast. About the ward ave its really your choice but she should be safe in a unit. but its your choiuce

Switch sword and ring for Noble Blood and unholy cynosure. Much more versatile and useful.

Drop the spirit host, get a bunker for your necros with the points.

The GG are too small. Put the count in a block of 19 skeletons (i.e. drop a skeleton), and get a block of 10BKs with full command, barding and barrows.

You can drop the barding on the other knights. They should be flanking if they're that small.

Also, you have no dispel scrolls. I'd definitely try to squeeze at least one in. Possibly drop the warbanner.

I discussed my opponent's views on having 3 necromancers and a vampire, and since he didn't seem very pleased, i've removed one. Here's a list with still good magic, taking in account your suggestion. Except for the spirit hosts, i'd like to give them a try.
I've also replaced some skeletons with zombies, to give it a shot.

330 - Vampire count necrarch (general), level 2, Unholy cynosure, Noble blood of Nehekhara, dark acolyte
140 - Necromancer, level 2, book of Arkhan, dispel scroll
140 - Necromancer, level 2, Staff of damnation

50 - 5 wolves
50 - 5 wolves
40 - 5 ghouls
40 - 5 ghouls
185 - 19 skeletons, full command
185 - 19 skeletons, full command
145 - 15 zombies, full command

130 - 2 spirit hosts
199 - 10 black knights, musician, standard, warbanner
309 - 18 grave guards, full command, banner of barrows (hit on 3+)

1997 points
10 PD + 2 bounds items
6 DD + 1 Dispel scroll

Again, thanks for the previous comments, and welcome to the future ones :)

I would change Grave Guard for skeletons. In terms of kills they rarly make more kills to make them worth it. And although there T4 the fact that skeletons can be raised tends to make them more survivable I find. And since your a Necrach you should have no problem keeping the levels of the units up.

Zombie unit I would drop to bunker status.

I would then bump up the Spirit host to a unit of 3. Makes them more flexable and able to accept a causalty before they come usless. Then any spare points bump up the ghoul units.

The grave guard are too small to be effective. They need 2 characters in there for a decent rank bonus, which will mean your opponent will simply avoid them. They need to be 25 models, or left at home.

The spirit hosts are also too small. 3 bases is the optimum.

Also, 3 necromancers isn't bad at all. Could be a lot worse. Get a Wight lord with your spare hero slot, and switch the GG to black knights.

Grave guards or black knights, i end up with ~300 points units. Would it be wise to use two units of 8 knights ? Less expensive, but probably just as deadly.

Also, why is it so important to have 25 or so grave guards ? Surely you don't bring rank bonus from elite troops ? It'd be a lot cheaper to combine a charge or summon some zombies to provide the rank bonus while the grave guards deal the wounds, no ?

Spirit hosts, 3 bases, noted. If i can find the points, i'll bump 'em to 3.

25 is necessary to keep rank bonus after shooting. You always need rank bonus with as poor a WS as Grave guard have. And you'll need to summon a helluva lot of zombies to get a sufficient rank bonus.

Let's give it another try.

330 - Vampire count necrarch (general), level 2, Ring of the Night, Noble blood of Nehekhara, dark acolyte
140 - Necromancer, level 2, book of Arkhan, dispel scroll
140 - Necromancer, level 2, Staff of damnation

50 - 5 wolves
50 - 5 wolves
40 - 5 ghouls
40 - 5 ghouls
145 - 15 skeletons, full command
145 - 15 skeletons, full command
117 - 17 zombies, full command

130 - 2 spirit hosts
264 - 8 black knights, barding, musician, standard, banner of screams (roll extra dice for fear)
388 - 25 grave guards, full command, banner of barrows (hit on 3+)

1999 points
10 PD + 2 bounds items
6 DD + 1 Dispel scroll

I've replaced the Unholy Cynosore (even though it's a good power) with the ring of night, as i'm definitly not comfortable with my general and lord choice without a ward save.

I'll use my heavy cavalry with 8 of them, while my grave guards will go by 25 (i'd like to keep them because my opponent and myself like the models :) ). Not enough points to make the spirit hosts 3, though.

The cavalry are too small. They don't even get a rank bonus. And the screaming banner isn't exactly great. Warbanner will put you on better footing.

Drop the spirit host, and boost your knights to 10. Then get one skellie block of 19, and another of 20. Cut the zombies down to 10, with no command and use them as a bunker.

With the spare, get one ghoul unit up to 7 and the other up to 8.

And I'd really attempt to get another character. I'd switch the GG to 9 knights with banner of the barrows, and get a wight lord BSB with sword of the kings, gem of blood and heavy armour. You'll do a lot better.

I understand and accept every suggestion, except the cavalry rank bonus. Why would i want a rank bonus with my cavalry unit ? A single casualty, and that rank bonus is gone. And that's not a rare thing, is it ? Even with toughness 4 and save 2+, they're not invincible to a random shooting or spell killing one of them.

But 8 is pointless, huge and unwieldy. If you're not going for a rank, cut 'em down to 6.

Or simply get a unit of 11.

Rank bonuses are not only good because of the extra CR, but also with a 10+ strong unit, you're more likely to outnumber, which you're unlikely to ever do with a unit of 8. Even in 6th edition, units of 8 were pretty sucky outside of brettonnians (8+ character)

Oh, yes, outnumber ! I'm not used to a whole army that causes fear. I'll need to rethink my list. Again, thanks !

Well, I know a lot of people like big bk units, I do to, but I think with eight you should be able to get to the enemy with at lest seven left and that gives you a unit streagth of 14 so I think that would work just be careful with them. I fully ranked up unit of infantry will put them in their graves permenatly so avoid that. As for the banner thats really a big gamble, I know the idea is to scare them catch them then slaughter them, but if they stand that weapons skill 3 of yours is going to hurt. Adding a wight lord and swithching over to the BoB will make that yunit a nasty threat.

:ph43r:

Excellent recommandations : the knights don't have ranks, or one at most, hence they rely on kills. They need the banner of barrows to ease the kills. The grave guards have ranks and therefore don't necessarly need to slaughter many enemies. But both try to outnumber to use the autobreak rule (insane courage, whatever).

Alright, let's try again :

340 - Necrarch vampire lord, level 2, noble blood, ring of night, dark acolyte
150 - Necromancer, level 2, book of arkhan, dispel scroll
140 - Necromancer, level 2, staff of damnation

50 - 5 wolves
50 - 5 wolves
40 - 5 ghouls
40 - 5 ghouls
177 - 19 skeletons, full command
177 - 19 skeletons, full command
129 - 19 zombies, full command

344 - 11 black knights, barding, standard, musician, banner of barrows
355 - 24 grave guards, standard, musician, warbanner

Three blocks to hide my three characters, two steamrollers, 4 units to divert or protect my troops, and enough magic to add more corpses on the table.

Why units of 19? it's rather stupid... if you want to get the 3rd rank through putting a fragile necromancer it the unit you won't have him very long... Better drop the zombies to 10 models and use them as a necrobunker. for the remaining points you can buy those 2 skeletons and perhaps some bats or other support.

I'm still not very used to the necrobunker idea. Are you suggesting something like :

10 zombies, 20 skeletons, 20 skeletons deployed like this ?

SSSSS SSSSS
SSSSS SSSSS
SSSSS SSSSS
SSSSS SSSSS

--ZNZNZ
--ZZZZZ
----ZZ

10 zombies with 2 necromancers behind the two blocks of skeletons ?

Something like that. or wherever it is safe for the necromancers. Anyway the front rank of a frontline unit is always the worst option. personally I would direct all my attacks against them and even secrifice entire units just to take them down.

I think i understand :

340 - Necrarch vampire lord, level 2, noble blood, ring of night, dark acolyte
150 - Necromancer, level 2, book of arkhan, dispel scroll
140 - Necromancer, level 2, staff of damnation

50 - 5 wolves
50 - 5 wolves
40 - 5 ghouls
40 - 5 ghouls
185 - 20 skeletons, full command
185 - 20 skeletons, full command
60 - 10 zombies

369 - 12 black knights, barding, standard, musician, banner of barrows
368 - 25 grave guards, standard, musician, warbanner

The two necromancers will hide with the zombies, behind the skeletons. I don't know yet where to place my vampire, but the rest of the army list seems alright to me.

I would drop one knight and add two ghouls to each of your ghoul unit, that way if a fleeing enemy is fourced through them it will still auto kill even with two previous casualties. Also you had a necharh lord at level 2 ???? buy the level 3 get nioble blood as you said he'll then be a level 4 spell caster. Also consider yousing lore of death with him it rocks if you have other caster to cast IoN.

The vampire will go where you will need him most. That's tactical flexibility.

Looking at point cost this is a count not a lord.

I'd either get a lord or WL. It'd just add a bit more punch.

Yes, my bad. It's a lord slot choice, but it's a vampire count. Once again, thanks to everyone for the advice.