View Full Version: What to do?

Vns Message Board > Have your say > What to do?


Title: What to do?
Description: VNS


GUEST-galpal - July 25, 2008 03:59 AM (GMT)
I have a 41 year old mentally handicapped daughter who has been having seizures since the age of 1 1/2. At age 15 they discovered a brain tumor and she had surgery. They gave her 2 years. At age 35, she had surgery again for the brain tumor. It was down graded to a grade I from a grade III malignant glioma. Her seizures have never been fully controled but are down to one or two a month and there are some times when she has a run of them that can last for hours. Starting as grand mal and then slowing to partial onset. She also has weakness on one side due to the surgeries so uses a walker. She resides at a residential facility and recently has been having some behavior problems. We aren't sure if they are due to her surroundings or something else since we don't see them when she is home visiting. She has been diagnosed with depression and possibly bi-polar disorder. The facility where she resides wanted to put her on lithium but before they could do that, there had to be blood work and an EKG. The EKG showed her rhythms were normal but also showed some heart damage due to a possible heart attack. We decided to hold off on the addition of the lithium until after she is seen by a cardiologist but now her neurologist is really pushing for the VNS because of the seizures and the depression. After reading some of the post here and even before that, I had my reservations about it. We have done some research on it over the last couple of years but whenever we would mention anything negative that we had heard, we were told that the doctors just don't know how to adjust it. We just don't know if it's worth putting her through the surgery and adjustments with all the possible side affects we have heard and read about. Does anyone who has the VNS out there, also have a brain tumor? We have only heard from one who does and she is still taking all the same meds, her seizures have changed and the battery has to be replaced every 3 years. We would like more input if anyone can help. :Help:

Dispatch - July 25, 2008 07:38 PM (GMT)
:Welcome: GalPal.

I would encourage you to become a member so you can get the full benefits of the board by reading peoples success and horror stories.

You will be able to access the Physicians & Patient Manuals right here on the site as a member. I encourage you to read them, ask a gazillion questions, and research, research, and more research. VNS is known to cause heart issues, so I would really ask a lot of questions regarding that. It is also unapproved for use in a person with a traumatic brain injury, but I'm not sure if a brain tumor is classified as a TBI.

Again, welcome to the board, and please register as a member so you can do a bunch of research and visit with people with 1st hand experience with the VNS.

Dispatch B)

labrat - July 26, 2008 02:02 PM (GMT)
Welcome to the board! :Welcome: As stated above, get yourself a screen name, what you have is fine, and choose a password. That's all there is too it. A whole new world will open to you. You will probably fine answers to questions you have already here.

Please become a member. It offers so many more benefits. :D

Birdbomb - July 26, 2008 04:23 PM (GMT)
Your daughter has a laundry list of medical problems! It has been my experiance, as the owner of this site, and I have spoken to 100's of people worldwide about VNS, that the more problems you have the LESS likely VNS will be of any benifit.

I have had several members who like your daugher, had many issues, every one had dismal results and on top of that the side effects became a life long issue.

It sounds like the facility is looking for a "quick fix" and VNS is a far cry from that description!. It is ADJUNTIVE therapy.


QUOTE
4. WARNINGS ________________________
Physicians should inform patients about all potential risks and adverse
events discussed in the VNS Therapy System physician’s manuals.

Use (depression)—
This device is a permanent implant. It is only to be used in patients
with severe depression who are unresponsive to standard psychiatric
management. It should only be prescribed and monitored by
physicians who have specific training and expertise in the
management of treatment-resistant depression and the use of this
device. It should only be implanted by physicians who are trained in
surgery of the carotid sheath and have received specific training in
the implantation of this device.

Use (epilepsy)—The VNS Therapy System should only be
prescribed and monitored by physicians who have specific training
and expertise in the management of seizures and the use of this
device. It should only be implanted by physicians who are trained in
surgery of the carotid sheath and have received specific training in
the implantation of this device.

Not curative (depression)—Physicians should warn patients that
VNS Therapy has not been determined to be a cure for depression.
Patients should be counseled to understand that individual results
will likely vary. Beneficial results might not become evident for
months. Most patients will continue to require antidepressant
medications and/or electroconvulsive therapy (ECT) in addition to
VNS Therapy.

The VNS Therapy device is not curative (epilepsy)—Physicians
should warn patients that VNS Therapy is not a cure for epilepsy
and that since seizures may occur unexpectedly, patients should
consult with a physician before engaging in unsupervised activities,
such as driving, swimming, and bathing, and in strenuous sports that
could harm them or others.

Unapproved uses—The safety and efficacy of the VNS Therapy
System have not been established for uses outside the “Intended
Use / Indications” section of this multi-part physician’s manual,
including (but not limited to) patients with:
�� Acute suicidal thinking or behavior (depression)
�� History of schizophrenia, schizoaffective disorder or
delusional disorders (depression)
�� History of rapid cycling bipolar disorder (depression)
�� History of previous therapeutic brain surgery or CNS injury
�� Progressive neurological diseases other than epilepsy or
depression
�� Cardiac arrhythmias or other abnormalities
�� History of dysautonomias
�� History of respiratory diseases or disorders, including dyspnea
and asthma
�� History of ulcers (gastric, duodenal, or other)
�� History of vasovagal syncope
�� Only one vagus nerve
�� Other concurrent forms of brain stimulation
�� Pre-existing hoarseness
�� Under 12 years of age (epilepsy)
�� Under 18 years of age (depression)
�� Primary generalized seizures

Worsening depression/suicidality (depression)—Patients being
treated with adjunctive VNS Therapy should be observed closely
for clinical worsening and suicidality, especially at the time of VNS
Therapy stimulation parameter changes or drug or drug dose
changes, including either increases or decreases in the stimulation
parameters or concomitant treatments. Consideration should be
given to changing the therapeutic regimen of VNS Therapy or
concomitant treatments, including possibly discontinuing VNS
Therapy or the concomitant therapy, in patients whose depression is
persistently worse or whose emergent suicidality is severe, abrupt in
onset, or was not part of the patient’s presenting symptoms.

Dysfunctional cardiac conduction systems—The safety and
effectiveness of the VNS Therapy System in patients with
predisposed dysfunction of cardiac conduction systems (re-entry
pathway) have not been established. Evaluation by a cardiologist is
recommended if the family history, patient history, or
electrocardiogram suggests an abnormal cardiac conduction
pathway. Serum electrolytes, magnesium, and calcium should be
documented before implantation. Additionally, postoperative
bradycardia can occur among patients with certain underlying
cardiac arrhythmias. Post-implant electrocardiograms and Holter
monitoring are recommended if clinically indicated.

It is important to follow recommended implantation procedures and
intraoperative product testing described in the Implantation and
Follow-up part of this multi-part physician’s manual. During the
intraoperative System Diagnostics (Lead Test), infrequent incidents
of bradycardia and/or asystole have occurred. If asystole, severe
bradycardia (heart rate < 40 bpm), or a clinically significant change
in heart rate is encountered during a System Diagnostics (Lead Test)
or during initiation of stimulation, physicians should be prepared to
follow guidelines consistent with Advanced Cardiac Life Support
(ACLS).

Additionally, postoperative bradycardia can occur among patients
with certain underlying cardiac arrhythmias. If a patient has
experienced asystole, severe bradycardia (heart rate < 40 bpm) or a
clinically significant change in heart rate during a System
Diagnostics (Lead Test) at the time of initial device implantation, the
patient should be placed on a cardiac monitor during initiation of
stimulation.

The safety of this therapy has not been systematically established for
patients experiencing bradycardia or asystole during VNS Therapy
System implantation.


Swallowing difficulties—Difficulty swallowing (dysphagia) may
occur with active stimulation, and aspiration may result from the
increased swallowing difficulties. Patients with pre-existing
swallowing difficulties are at greater risk for aspiration. Appropriate
aspiration precautions should be taken for such patients.

Dyspnea or shortness of breath—Dyspnea (shortness of breath)
may occur with active VNS Therapy. Any patient with underlying
pulmonary disease or insufficiency such as chronic obstructive
pulmonary disease or asthma may be at increased risk for dyspnea
and should have their respiratory status evaluated prior to
implantation and monitored following initiation of stimulation.

Obstructive sleep apnea—Patients with obstructive sleep apnea
(OSA) may have an increase in apneic events during stimulation.
Lowering stimulus frequency or prolonging “OFF” time may
prevent exacerbation of OSA. Vagus nerve stimulation may also
cause new onset sleep apnea in patients who have not previously
been diagnosed with this disorder. It is recommended that patients
being considered for VNS Therapy who demonstrate signs or
symptoms of OSA, or who are at increased risk for developing
OSA, should undergo the appropriate evaluation(s) prior to
implantation.

Device malfunction—Device malfunction could cause painful
stimulation or direct current stimulation. Either event could cause
nerve damage and other associated problems. Patients should be
instructed to use the Magnet to stop stimulation if they suspect a
malfunction, and then to contact their physician immediately for
further evaluation. Prompt surgical intervention may be required if a
malfunction occurs.

MRI—Patients with the VNS Therapy System or any part of the
VNS Therapy System implanted should not have full body MRI.
Additional surgery may be required to remove the VNS Therapy
system if full body MRI is required.

Excessive stimulation—Excessive stimulation at an excess duty
cycle (that is, one that occurs when “ON” time is greater than
“OFF” time) has resulted in degenerative nerve damage in
laboratory animals. An excess duty cycle can be produced by
continuous or frequent magnet activation (> 8 hours), as determined
by animal studies. Do not stimulate at these combinations of ranges.

Device manipulation—Patients who manipulate the Pulse
Generator and Lead through the skin (Twiddler’s Syndrome) may
damage or disconnect the Lead from the Pulse Generator and/or
possibly cause damage to the vagus nerve. Patients should be
warned against manipulating the Pulse Generator and Lead.

Sudden unexplained death in epilepsy (SUDEP): Through
August 1996, 10 sudden and unexplained deaths (definite, probable,
and possible) were recorded among the 1,000 patients implanted
and treated with the VNS Therapy device. During this period, these
patients had accumulated 2,017 patient-years of exposure.
Some of these deaths could represent seizure-related deaths in
which the seizure was not observed, at night, for example. This
number represents an incidence of 5.0 definite, probable, and
possible SUDEP deaths per 1,000 patient-years.
Although this rate exceeds that expected in a healthy (nonepileptic)
population matched for age and sex, it is within the range of
estimates for epilepsy patients not receiving vagus nerve
stimulation, ranging from 1.3 SUDEP deaths for the general
population of patients with epilepsy, to 3.5 (for definite and
probable) for a recently studied antiepileptic drug (AED) clinical
trial population similar to the VNS Therapy System clinical cohort,
to 9.3 for patients with medically intractable epilepsy who were
epilepsy surgery candidates.

oreo - July 26, 2008 05:59 PM (GMT)
Maybe you've already decided to become a member to gain access to a gold mine of info regarding personal experiences with all aspects of VNS. I hope you have.

I'm sure researching the safety and efficacy of VNS for your daughter is on the top of your list. Since the insurance/monetary aspects can be just as tricky to figure out, I just can't help, even at this early stage, letting you know that the "battery replacement" that Cyberonics talks about is actually a complete new generator implant.

When the battery reaches EOL (end of life), a new surgery has be be scheduled and the entire generator is removed and replaced with a new one. Despite the fact that Cyberonics often tells people the entire surgery including the implant and all hospital and physician fees will be around $25,000......the generator itself costs more than $23,000. So, in 2006, my total costs were over $47,000. That does not include post-surgery routine doctor visits to monitor and adjust the dose....anywhere from $90.00-$300.00 a visit.

My implant was for depression, and I do receive some significant benefits. I also have a number of uncomfortable, sometimes painful side effects. I am also still battling with my insurance who approved my surgery...paid for it...and then two years later took back their payment and are trying to make me responsible for over $47,000 in bills.

The posts you've read here will certainly give you the idea that there is a lot of research to be done...and unfortunately most doctors and their offices are poorly informed about the true risks involved.

I wish you luck...hope to see you on the board!

galpal - August 5, 2008 02:28 PM (GMT)
Thank all of you for your feedback. I did register at the time of my post but not sure if it has been approved yet. Will I receive something telling me that I have full access?
We have pretty much decided against the VNS for our daughter and have an appt. with her neurologist in Sept. which we were suppose to get pushed up, but figured it would be more of the same with him wanting us to go ahead with it and not wanting to try anything else. I am grateful to this website though since I will go to the next appt. armed with a lot of info against the implant. None of which he has ever addressed when speaking to us about it. When we have questioned different things like so many we have heard of who got no relief from seizures or the need to replace the unit in as little as 3 years, we hear the same thing, " their doctors don't know how to set it right". That leads us to believe that her doctor is the only one in the world who does and what happens when he retires??? In weighing the pros and cons, I just can't see where it would be worth it to put her through all that is involved, when there is no guarantee that it will help and may even cause more problems than she already has.
I will continue to research it on this site until her appt. and will certainly be printing out much of the info to take with us.
Thank you all so much again for your words of experience.

Birdbomb - August 5, 2008 09:50 PM (GMT)
I didn't see your registration in queue, please take the time to register again.

Guest - August 6, 2008 03:41 AM (GMT)
Just registered again. Hope you get it this time.
Thanks again.



Hosted for free by InvisionFree