Personally I say let'em... there gonna do it anyway so I'm a yes...

a massive 100% yes from me! -y let straight people be the only ones to experience divorce lol

That's what I figure! HA HA HA! Truthfully I thought you might get mad at this... but with Mr. Bush trying to amend the const of America I thought it belongs here... So we could at least discuss it.

not at all this is a ver valid issue... and having many gay friends and such... i really dont mind... and if anyone does tell them to come see me lol....

moreover its mentioned a lot in the west wing as well.....

It's talked alot in the west wing!? I haven't noticed... :) Yeah. Personally I hope the amendment gets shot down... but if it passes. eh.

yeah barlet goes on about so called gay bashing and may gay bill amendments....

Yeah I know. Do you think the amendment will pass?

even if the president doesnt sign it... it wil pass through the house anyway.

For religion reasons, no gays should not marry but hey who am I to judge, they going to do it anyway rather Bush signs it or not. Let God handle things. But I persoanlly do not hate Gay people. I love em just as if a straight cause I love people. I just don't judge. I use to but not anymore.
Cause gay people have feelings also.

I am a VERY religious person... and homosexuality is a sin but I think Bartlet sumed that up well with Dr. Jacobs. Looking at it purely from a religious view I don't agree with it, but I see no reason in not letting them get married... in a worldly sense. I know that God wont see it as valid as written in te scriptures. I do not judge them... I cant come even close to doing that. In that we agree.

I'm a gay Christian woman; my faith challenges to be a better person, gay or not!

The bible says very little about homosexuality and most have that has been taken outta context anyway [and it says nothing about gay women], I always take joy at reading Gen 1:27 tho!

I didn't know... don't take offense to my statements, but it's how I feel... at least I'm honest about it.

The Bible says quite a bit about it... in two or three places, actually.
Lev 18:22, 20:13
Deut. 23:17
Isa. 3:9
Rom. 1:27
1 Cor. 6:9
1 Tim. 1:10
Jude 1:7

See also: Gen. 13:13, 18:20, Ezek. 16:50, 2 Tim. 3:3, 2 Pet. 2:10

Context is the universal argument to nearly EVERY religious debate. Have you noticed this too? :lol: And it is usually used when a more valid point can't be found... not saying you did this but just that it is!

You know many people would argue that the Bible DOES say this... but you are right, the Bible (KJV) doesn't specifically say it is wrong... it does say that a woman can't approach a beast... Well depending on the guy\girl… but... It does say, though, time and time again that a woman, with long hair, wearing a dress while staying silent in church, should get married to a man and have children (the younger the better). And that a woman is nothing without the man; and the man is nothing without the woman.

I like this verse to.

BTW: Were you a yes vote or a no vote? Or a I don't care vote?

Now. To the political side:

Why wouldn't the president sign it!? It's HIS bill. I don't know if it'll pass the house... There are a lot more demo's there now then there were before. Of course then there is a lot of Republicans against the ban... I'm one of them. (REPUBLICANS RULE! better then the demo's :P :)) I hope the ban doesn't pass.

Of course if you believe, like a lot of people, that the ban was nothing more than a ploy to get reelected...

I really don't want to put my side of the argument, everyone has a valid opinion. I am biased because of the way I live my life. In addition it's something I know a fair bit about.


I have a degree in Religious studies, and a masters in the same subject specialising in the mis-interpretation of biblical references specifically homosexuality. I tend to get quite emotive and spout out various technical arguments that mean very little to lay people [i don't mean to patronise, that's not what I mean!]

I will say this though, religion has to evolve. When things stay static they die; society changes and we simply have to adjust to it. How many people that call themselves Christians keep kosher or ritually wash themselves before meals as set out in the holiness codes? Things change, and faith has to change.


I will however remind you of what Rabbi Glassman said in 'take this sabbath day'

Just seemed apt!

I agree with you. I believe that the ban on gay marriage would be a step in the wrong direction for this country. And while I disagree with your lifestyle it is not up to me to judge you because as the Bible says all judgements are left to the Son... last I checked I wasn't Jesus. That'd be cool though - I could walk through walls and stuff! ;)

You have a degree in religious studies!? Cool. I hope to be getting one of those soon... but the work is hard! :)

No hard feelings, right!?

EDITED: cuase I cannat spil a danr ting :lol:

nah, no worries, no hard feelings. Where are you studying?

Good luck with the studies. I enjoed studying for my degree's was the best fun ever, and always a conversation starter when meeting new people! [so is the job I do now tho, I marry people as a registrar of marriages!! often I tell strangers that I marry people for money, always raises a few eye brows!]

i take it that it then becomes a conversation stopper lol.

:lol: yeah... starter and stopper all in one! :lol: I am currently trying to get a degree in education and administration and English Lit. (Majors.) I want to be an English Teacher. But my many minors include Sysytem Administrations and Theology. I am an ordained Minister but I don't use that much.

ah, see we have a fair bit in common, I got ordained on the internet [although that was more to do with a twisted sense of humour than faith development!] As a catholic it is very unlikely that I will ever be an ordained minister!

I used to be a teacher, religious studies in a all boys high school [do you have RE lessons in 'normal' high schools or faith schools?] I absolutely hated it, but that was more to do with politics than the pupils

As for registraring being a conversation stopper, it actually tend to be a raised eyebrow! It tends to always give me things to talk about, not that I need it, I can chat to anyone!

You got ordained on the net? :lol: Was that the ULC [Universal Life Church]? That's not a legal ordination in my state... or in many of the states in the "Bible belt." I do appreciate the twisted humor there. I do take my ordination seriously though... most of the time.

Religious studies of any kind in a "normal high school?" Run by the sate? Nope. Private high schools aren't "normal."

I got ordained on the ULC, as did my dog actually! It looked cool to have Rev. Almond on my credit card! I am that shallow! [it's also useful to use when trying to get reservations for dinner!]

The school I taught in was a state run school although it was catholic. RE in the UK is weird because Schools [State run or private] are legally obliged to provide Religious Education but provide no curriculum, that's upto the local education districts so if there is a high population of Jews, they can tailor it to that.

The whole religion thing is a little different in the UK, people are slightly more conversative in terms of proclaiming what they believe if anything. I am the only Christian amongst my friends, no one else has any type of religious conviction. [although a perhaps one in three primary and high schools are religious?? Go figure!] Would you say that is true in the US? Are young people running away from Churches?

From what I can see from the US, politics is certainly influenced by religion more over there, I understand the separation of Church and state, what I mean is that politicians religious views are more public as is the pro life/choice debate. To be honest I couldn't tell you our prime minster's views on that, but whether that is appathy on my behalf I couldn't say???

I'm very dissapointed by this comment and indeed many of the thoughts posted on this subject. I expected more from the people who are fans of WW as I naively thought that those same fans would be as intelligent an open minded as Bartlett and his politics.
Clearly not. He is a Christian. I am a Christian. The Old Testament was written to govern a time of barbarism and immorality. Many of the guidelines in the Bible refer to a time long past and are not applicable to our modern lives.
You speak about the Dr. Jacobs scene yet you clearly haven't taken it's message on board.
The true rules that Bible asks us to live by are The Ten Commandments, I don't recall homosexuality being mentioned in that particularly passage.
If the New Testament teaches us anything, it is that we are all sinners in the eyes of God. None of us can expect to live up to his and his Son's example. Jesus died so that we may all be forgiven. All of us. If being gay is a sin, it's no more a sin than working on a sunday.
I'm not for gay marriage, I'm not against it either. But when you start condemning people as sinners, look at yourself.
Who are you to cast the first stone?

Dont you just hate it when people use your own words to condem you for holding the very same view they hold. Dude, you didn't read that clearly did you!? We hold the SAME views. You need to read the posts clearly before you post something. Yes I talked about Dr. Jacobs. That's a great encounter. Obviously you don't understand the reference. Don't be quick to condem those that hold your own views.

And BTW: all the fans of TWW aren't tree-hugging-hippie-Liberals. lol I myself am a Republican... you know... REAL polotics! haha j\k :)

And for the record, I say let them have a worldly marriage if they want.

sorry newbie but i must disagree. The ten commandments were written to govern a world of barbarism. They were specifically written for the irealites delivered from egypt.
We if you belive in the bible and its doctrine are now governed by the new testament. Its a new covenent, covenet being the operative word there meaning agreement. so read your bible again and read it closely, its full of useful information if you wish to engage in theo political discourse.

Simple truth in mine eyes is that homosexuality is bad. 56% of documtented aids cases is reported by homosexuals. Its an extremely mal-adaptive trait. The problem with it comes from the fact the since both parties in men are responsible for invasive fluid discharges the odds of becoming infected are greater than that of a man and women. Also with with regards to women, a woman of the homosexual orientation is less likely to produce offspring. offspring are key element in the practice of speciation and evolution. Gay marriage supports and sanctions the practice of homosexuality. providing a safe haven for those who have decided they were no longer going to pursue the opposite sex because of some wrong they encounterd or some other factor contributing to a phenomenon which is both learned and inherit.

its a practice that should be strongly discouraged.

i have no problem with samesexuals, they are just people. i also have no problem with kleptomaniacs. That does not mean i have to condone the things they do

peace.