Okay, guys, this is something I was thinking earlier today. Imagine this: The JLA went rogue. I’m not talking about some lame-o version of the JL, I’m talking about the big seven: Aquaman, Batman, Flash, Green Lantern (Kyle Rayner), Martian Manhunter, Superman ‘n Wonder Woman. The world is screwed right? Maybe not.

The U.N. (that once sponsored the Team) wants to put together a team to fight the Rogue JLA and take ‘em down. And they CHOSE YOU to select seven heroes to fight the Rogue JLA. You can choose just about any hero in the planet. Again up to seven characters. So, who are you going to choose?

My list for the best team suited to battle against a Rogue JLA...

Leader:

Nightwing: Dick Grayson is one of the best leaders (if not the best) in the DCU. Batman said that Dick is one of most capable leaders he's ever known, on many occasion such as the classic ‘Teen Titans/ Batman & Outsiders’ Crossover. Nightwing has led the Titans (nearly every incarnation) and the new Outsiders and was given command of the JLA, when the primary team was ‘killed’. The only reason Nightwing has never taken a permanent role in the JLA is because he refused it on several occasions. Nightwing is a natural tactician and has access to Batman’s contingency plans on every DCU hero. Nightwing knows Batman better than anyone else on the planet and would know what to expect from his mentor. He'd be best to lead an assult that would win.


Zatanna: Skilled sorceress, Zatanna would be an excellent choice for the team. Her mystical abilities are top notch would prove to be a strong weapon against Superman, who is susceptible to magicks.


Raven: Raven’s soul-self would prove a strong weapon against both Flash and Martian Manhunter. She would be protected against J’on’s telepathy, while able to curve Wally’s emotions and mind. Back in the old days, Raven was empathically controlling Wally in order to get him to join the Titans.


Batgirl (III): World’s Greatest Martial Artist. Cassandra Cain defeated the once undefeatable Lady Shiva in mortal combat. She can read the movements of any opponent, and anticipate any attack. She has fought many of meta-human and kicked their butts, and would prove a valued member in defeating the Rogue JLA.

OR
Green Arrow (I or II): Oliver Queen and Conner Hawke are the world’s two greatest archers on earth. Either would prove good ‘snipers’ against the rogue JLA. Their skills are unmatched, and Conner is considered a major ‘meta-human beater’.


Captain Marvel: Cap is the world’s Mightiest Mortal and the team needs a powerhouse, considering the JLA has three of them. With his powers magically based, that gives Billy a bit of an advantage, and his strength is only slightly weaker than Superman or Wonder Woman’s.


Oracle: If knowledge is power, then Barbara Gordon is the most powerful woman in the DCU. Her skills would prove crucial in a fight against the JLA, since she could analyze and give the team important information in which to defeat the rogue heroes.

Of course this list was a tough call. I had many other choices that I long debated over. Among my ‘back-ups’ I had were: The Atom, Robin (III), Jay Garrick (Flash I), Sentiel (Green Lantern I), Supergirl (IV) or Superboy.

Of course the biggest problem is going up against a team who has Batman on it. As mentioned before Batman has files that will kill and take down every hero in the DCU. Those files would prove to be the strongest card in the rogue JLA’s deck.

I'd pick...

Rising Sun:To defeat the Martian Manhunter you'll need fire and Rising Sun(Japan's hero) is just the guy to stop him.

Mister Majestic:As strong as Superman,Majestic could be the team's resident phycho and strongman.

Platic Man:Eel O'Brien knows the identities of all the Big 7 giving the team information.Oh yeah and beat up Green Lantern.

Green Arrow II:Connor can copy skills and could take on Batman.

Monitou Raven:Size-Changing could crush Aquaman and so Raven was choen.

Huntress:Simple:Revenge on Wonder Woman just tranq her.

Flash 1:Jay Garrick the fastest man and Wally's second mentor will take his pupil down.

Jay Garrick isn't the World's Fastest Man. That title belongs to Wally West alone, who's speed and abilities long surpassed Jay's. Jay is the World's second fastest man.

And not to be nosey, but Huntress against Wonder Woman... that not much of a fight. Helena couldn't win. Diana has those lightning reflects and would deflect the tranqs with her braclets just in time to snap Helena's neck.

TEAM LEADER:


Hawkman (Carter Hall) - He's vicious, he's mean, he has thousands of years of experience and he was the guy bossing around Sentinel (!) 'n Spectre (!!!) back in the day! And Carter isn't just muscles he's an extremely bright man, something said by the smartest man on the planet Ray Palmer.



Firestorm (Ronny Raymond & Professor Stein) - Firestorm can manipulate the atomic structure of the ENTIRE PLANET!!! Enough Said! Plus he could take down J'onzz creating fire or lava around 'im. Just like that.



Dr. Fate (Hector Hall) - The Greatest Wizard in the DCU. He's powers would be really necessary in order to take Superman down.



Black Adam (Theo Adam) - He'd be another choice to take down Superman, being his power of magic nature and everything, plus him being a Luny gives him an edge.



Mr. Terrific (Michael Holt) - The current chairman of the JSA is also one of the smartest man in the planet. He's a brilliant tactician and he'll be the man formulating the plans. He's also a gifted scientist and his inventions are top notch.



Bronze Tiger - This is the man who trained Richard Dragon, IMHO the best martial artist in the DCU. That alone would give 'im some credit, but he also recently defeated Dragon and this is the guy who mopped the floor with Deathstroke. He should put that on his business card. :D



Spectre (Hal Jordan) - He is Spectre. 'nuff said.

My backup team would be: Lex Luthor (Team Leader), he would love to kick supes ass and would do it gladly, Richard Dragon, Shift or Metamorpho, Supergirl (Kara Zor El), Sentinel, Jason Blood 'n Green Arrow I or Green Arrow II.

Good choices.

But... um, Richard Dragon isn't the DCU's best martial artist. He's the Best master of the Kung-Fu arts, and he's up in the top 5 , that's for dang sure, but Richard has never been able to beat Lady Shiva in combat and neither had Bronze Tiger. Neither has gone up against Batgirl who defeated Shiva, unaided in mortal combat, so niether can make the claim. According to everything I've ever read, Shiva and Batgirl are the two best martial artists in the DCU. Richard Dragon is simply the master of Kung Fu and stuff.

No, no, no, Richard Dragon mastered every single Martial Art known to man. I don't know if you're reading his new series and he trained six assassins in different styles, (Capoeira, Krav-Maga 'n others).

Now the best Martial Artist from the DC Universe, this is a tricky subject and I think that there's no "TRUE" answer. If you go to any thread on the subject on the DC Official Message Board you'll see that no one agrees. This is my Top Ten Best Martial Artists. Again, my opinion based on the information I gathered.

01 - Richard Dragon & Lady Shiva*.
02 - Bronze Tiger & Batman*.
03 - Constantine Drakon.
04 - Batgirl.
05 - Deathstroke.
06 - Green Arrow II (Connor Hawke).
07 - Nightwing & The Question* (Shiva said that he was a natural).
08 - Wildcat (Ted Grant).
09 - Silver Monkey.
10 - Ra's Al Ghul.

Although I don't think that Batman is the best martial artist, per se, I think that he can beat everyone in here cuz he's so darn tricky.

*ties.

I have been reading the Dragon series, but his fighting styles lack in many areas. He doesn't know EVERY martial art, because he mentioned that in that Huntress Mini-series when he trained Helena.

I have looked at the message board and many people agree.

But those lists we made BEFORE Batgirl and Shiva fought.

Fact: Batgirl is better than Batman as a martial artist. Batman admits to that. He calls her the perfect human weapon.

Fact: Batgirl beat Lady Shiva alone and using martial arts only. No help, no weapons. Just fist against fist. Something no one else has accomplished. Not Batman, not Bronze Tiger, not Richard Dragon, and not Green Arrow II. Whenever they've fought Shiva, they've used other means to help them.

Fact: Batgirl has also learned every single martial art known to man, and she has her '6th sense' that allows her to know the movements of her opponents before they can even breath simply by looking at the way they stand and move. Its the next best thing to ESP.

And Batman is listed a one of the best martial artists, because he too knows all forms of martial arts and is trained to human perfection. But that doesn't mean he's not above using 'other means' to defeat his opponents.

Based on all the evidence that is listed in comics and online...

1. Batgirl & Lady Shiva
2. Richard Dragon
3. Bronze Tiger
4. Batman
5. King Snake
6. Green Arrow II
7. Deathstroke
8. Nightwing
9. Question
10. Silver Monkey

Also, Deathstroke is not really a martial artists. He's a weapons combatant first and foremost. Same thing with Wildcat. He's a boxer, but he doesn't know many other forms of martial arts.

Perhaps you are right, but before I say Cassandra is better than Dragon or Tiger I'd like to see 'em fight. A lot of people doesn't seem to think that Cassandra is the best Martial Artists and I'm one of them, sorry.

Another thing when I say "Martial Artist" I mean hand to hand fighter and Ted Grant is amongst the top 15 AT THE VERY LEAST. The guy single handedly beat the Injustice Society of America. But anyway, let's just agree to disagree, right? Takes different strokes and all that... :D

And those lists were made AFTER she beat Shiva.

That's cool. But Richard first needs to defeat Shiva, before he can face Batgirl.

The day he can beat Shiva, one-on-one fight, no help, then we'll talk. :D

As for those list, if they are after, then that mean the creators must not have ever read a lot of Batgirl comics.

That might happen very, very soon.

Key word being 'might'. And lets not forget he has Bronze Tiger watching his back here.

Batgirl went up against Shiva completely alone. B)

By the way, very cool choices, Alan.

I don't think that Ben will help though... Dragon and Shiva have some history, I think that they'll fight alone. But, that's just a guess.

Thanks.

I spent a lot of time debating between Atom and Oracle. Atom's size changing makes him difficult to combat, especially if he enters one's body and does the brain lombotmy like he did to Darksied in a possible future.

But Oracle's information is looked to by everyone in the DCU, and her information is often key in many major battles. So her brain and her hard-drive won out for me.

Tiger might not WANT to help, but if Shiva is about to use her leapard blow, a move that can't be blocked, on Dragon... well, I don't doubt that Tiger would jump in to save his bud. Part of being a hero, is always having a problem standing by and watching a friend die.

I'd be thorn too. But I'd prob'ly choose Atom, the more people on the field the better. And I think that if the League went rogue, Oracle would be the first to go down.

I think that he'll be either unconscious or fighting the other dudes.

Maybe. If they're smart and don't go super-villain stupid, like most people do.

But you never mentioned them taking down any heroes previously to the new team forming, meaning that Oracle would still be in the fight.

Most people underestimate Oracle.

Batman would consider her a threat, but if Nightwing's crew gets to the rogue League first, then they couldn't do much against Oracle.

No doubt Bat's has Babs' computers bugged and stuff for a contingency, but he can't know ALL the upgrades that she, Robin and Blue Beetle put in, when he's not there.

I doubt it. Fighting other people maybe, but he'd show up when Richard needs a hand. 4 out of 5 times, no one beats Shiva in unarmed combat alone or it ends in a draw. Batgirl is the only known exception.

Perhaps. But Sometime she'll have to go down. :glunk: Should I add Cheschire and Ollie to my list?

Of martial artists? No, I don't think so.

Oliver, while trained in fighting, is no where near the level as the others. He's skilled more in tracking and archery.

Cheshire is another who knows martial arts, but isn't good enough to be listed with the others. She can fight, but she's more skilled in guns and toxins, rather than pshyical confrontation.

And Shiva already has gone down. Only it was Batgirl who took her down. Cassie is just that good. She found Shiva's weak spot and took it.