Title: Increasing 1g-fe Capacity
YellowIS - February 12, 2007 02:00 AM (GMT)
Has anyone taken a stock 1g-fe auto motor from a IS200 before and machined out the cyclinders to increase the capacity of the motor?
I am toying with this idea + a piggyback comp and exhaust
tte supercharger + piggyback comp and exhaust
IMO Turbos are too messy/un engineered and a engine swap is too much work / not worth it on an auto. I am after more response/accelerating power at speed.
Any ideas on the final capacity achived and the cost involved/estimated?
jeremyflower - February 12, 2007 04:56 AM (GMT)
I have to say that I don't think it'd be worth the time and hassle involved, you'd be much better off doing a swap for something different.
1G-FE just isn't a performance engine, they used to fit a supercharged version of it to the old Toyota Crowns, gives an idea of the type of car it was designed to be fitted to...
It might be worth seeing about getting a bigger cam or some head work done if you want to keep the 1G-FE and stay Naturally Aspirated but I still think you'd be talking big money.
Sorry to be a big downer.
YellowIS - February 12, 2007 05:43 AM (GMT)
Thanks for the reply. I understand what you mean, its good to get a straight answer.
I am trying to avoid a engine change as I do not want to convert to change g/boxes or go through the hassle of new computers, wiring or making the current electronics/aircon work.
I think the best idea may be to stick with the aim to supercharge the motor and then spend some dollars tuning the car with an aftermarket computer/playing with induction/exhaust setups to make the power more accseible for regular driving.
jeremyflower - February 12, 2007 06:07 AM (GMT)
Where are you?
Next time I have $10-15k lying around doing nothing I'm gonna do the V8 conversion. I think that'd be the best useable power/cash ratio I could manage. I don't really want to spend more than that but I don't just wanna slap a turbo on it...
I've seen plenty of toyota V8 conversions now in Altezza, Hiluxes, Hiaces, even a little old Corolla SR Coupe so it can't be that expensive. They guy who did the Hiace said it would cost him more for a replacement diesel engine than for the whole V8 transplant.
YellowIS - February 12, 2007 06:36 AM (GMT)
I'm in Brisbane (qld aus).
Best of luck with the conversion. It definately would be the best bang for your buck.
Replacing the 1g-fe with soarer or even the supra motors would a good idea as there is alot available in the form of performace parts/knowledge and some of those motors are meant to be quite cheap to pick up.
On a personal note, i do like the idea of having a really powerful motor in such a nice looking car but i think it would loose some of its charm for me as it is my daily driver and it would be a fair bit of overkill for those extra 45-50kw i'd like out of my motor. Thanks for the advice it is great to get the opinon of someone with more experience with these cars.
greeneyes - February 13, 2007 05:43 AM (GMT)
Have a trawl through auto.vl.ru and see what other cars they used the 1GFE in.
Maybe they had it out to 2.3 litres in some odd model, although I suppose you would really need to know which block it used to be.
grahamd - February 13, 2007 09:58 AM (GMT)
I did a big bore on my 1G-FE - it's called a 1JZGTE.
Never heard of the 1G being bored too far - it's simpler to fit the 1JZ.
YellowIS - February 14, 2007 03:08 AM (GMT)
Now that i have further knowledge of what boring would mean i can see why it wouldn't be such a great idea. There is a very small (read not worthwhile) possible gain in power available by increasing the bore of the cylinder. Furthermore this would require new pistons which would most likely need to be custom made and would weaken the internal walls of the engine making it more prone to failure under hard working conditons.
The only alternative to this is changing the engine block which would also have to be custom made alongside a new set of cyclinder and wouldn't be cost justifiable.
I did however note that by getting a new set of pistons it would be possible to shorten the stroke of the pistons within the cyclinder hence lowering the compression ratio of the engine.
I am led to belive that this would result in a drop in power but an increase in torque.
Can anyone confirm or deny this? Would this possiblly give the car more drivability or would similar gains be felt from a camcon, customised exhaust and some lightweight wheels?
jeremyflower - February 14, 2007 04:36 AM (GMT)
If it were me, I'd go exhaust and air filter first, then wheels, then camcon (that's probably in order of expense too).
The 1G really isn't a performance engine unfortunately...
If you can find a complete 1G-GTE (factory turbocharged) or 1G-GZE (factory supercharged) you might be on the money.
I was talking about supercharging in this post: http://forum.altezzaclub.org.au/index.php?showtopic=2724
Might be of some help to you?
greeneyes - February 14, 2007 08:07 AM (GMT)
Don't drop the compression.
Most of the anemic properties of the 1GFE come from it's compression of only 10:1 compared to the 3SGE at 11.5:1
The first rule of motorsport is to skim the head and raise the compression for more power!
The Toyota Chaser came out with 1GFE, a 1JZ-GE and a 1JZ-GTE, all in the same car. (some were 4WD as well!)
So I assume a 1JZ, turbo'd or not, would replace a 1GFE easily.
The power figures are 160ps, 200ps and 280ps !! :woot:
The 1J had a compression of 10.5 for the NA, and 9:1 for the turbo. They are oversquare engines of 2.5litres. They have the same bore as a 3SGE (86mm), considerable bigger than your 1GFE at 75mm. However they are very short stroke, only 71,5mm compared to the 3SGE at 86 and the 1GFE at 75mm (That's why they are 'square' motors.}
All available here-http://english.auto.vl.ru/catalog/
A brilliant site I hope we never lose!!
grahamd - February 14, 2007 10:09 AM (GMT)
The 1JZ comes in 2 versions - non VVTi and late model VVTi's. Change was Aug 98. The early one has compression ratio of 8.5:1 and the late ones are 9:1.
They fit into the Altezza / IS200 as it is dimensional the same as the 2JZ fitted to the IS300 except for the overall height. The 2JZ is 30mm taller than the 1JZ.
YellowIS - February 15, 2007 04:33 AM (GMT)
Well after what you could call some solid research i've come to the same conclusion as everyone I think. Assuming that you are not mr/ms moneybags;
The only way to get a decent amount power into a 1g-fe powered is/as200 is by pulling the motor out and putting in a JZ series motor. Any decent conversion will also require a new gearbox and modifications to both the motor and the g/box.
Alternatively a turbo can be fitted to the 1g-fe. Any decent gain in power will also need to be accompanied by changing components such as a fuel pump/injectors and you will still require an aftermarket piggyback computer at the least to not kill your motor. This option will only be slightly less hassle, not as reliable and just as costly as an engine g/box transplant.
The TTE supercharger option dosen't give great gains for the cost involved. It is by far the simplest mod and the least obtrusive to the car's original conditon but 40kW for the cost is simply not worth the gain.
Any other mods to the 1g-fe such as a airfilters, piggyback/replacement ecu exahust/extractors and weight reduction will only result in small gains. There is not much potential to gain much extra power in a cost effective manner from this engine. (Read: THERE JUST ISIN'T SO STOP LOOKING AND IMAGINING!) If anyone can prove this wrong please be my guest. Never the less this taking on this option can also leave your car with a nice set of wheels and a nice tone and will let you play with your car's engine management which can be quite fun.
To end my speel I would just like to say that if ever there was a
low boost, variable vane (low lag) internal wastegate turbo, with an
independent cooling and lubrication (coolant and oil) setup,
boost controllable piggyback computer ,
air to air intercooler with all piping that looked asthetically pleasing kit produced that gave your engine 160kw+ on otherwise stock components available for around 5k installed that gave you a car that would potentially give you a 0-100 time of 6-7 seconds it would be good gains for the money spent and I'd go this option.
So pretty much there are the options as I see them.
I'm going to go the Filters, Exhaust, PowerFC/Camcon tuning, weight reduction path when the wallet is right. My is200 is going to stay my daily driver hopefully for many years to come and I'd rather spend the money I could on the 200 on a car with many/cheaper upgrades available. I do dream of building a s13, TT or supra streetcar in the not to distant future.
beerbaron - February 15, 2007 05:30 AM (GMT)
just get a standard 1jz in there
with a 5 speed supra box,piggyback ecu and nice exhaust
if you the leave the motor standard they are fairly reliable
shouldnt cost your more than 8k
money well spent in comparison to all the work you are planning to do with the 1gfe
MonsterMat - February 16, 2007 06:45 PM (GMT)
the most a 1g can be bored to is approx 2.1 as there is not enough room on the cylinder skirts for the conrod articulation.
the only real way of increasing the cc would be to bore, and stroke the engine, and due to the long cylinder skirt the stroking isnt possible...without making the already thin conrods ............thinner
so, not really worth it.