Ok having some trouble decideing on some stiffer Apexi springs, I've currently got a 10kg square cm or something spring in front and a 7 in the rear (japan measurement)!
Have been told to go for a 14 front and 10 rear.
However a wonder how much harder a 16 front and 12 rear would be for extra reasurance.

However most suspension shops measure the spring in pounds so know one can tell me how stiff its gonna be based on talking to a shop in hamilton? basically my front needs 20mm of less travel in the spring to fix the problem!

Can anybody help or know of a conversion for pounds to kgcm2.


Cheers Hayden...

:sigh:

Bring it up to Stocks in Auckland and talk to God. (Edgar)

He will measure the height of the car above the wheel centers & the travel possible in the strut, he will need the weight of the car, then he will take a spring off and test it for rate, and finally tell you what rate spring you need to give you the travel possible for that weight of car...

Do these people know the Altezzas have a 50:50 weight distribution? If the leverage is the same then the spring rate should be the same.

Grant Scheuber organised our suspension night there, he is the sales manager.

email him on gscheuber@georgestock.co.nz

thanks "greeneyes" that information is good but for some reason it cant be transfered to the japanese set up and spring rates. They do it different, the 14 and 10 rated springs that i've been recommened are really for track use I've been told so any higher is a drift set up and may give me prostate cancer from all the bouncing and vibration! my options are really limited, but I cant get any idea of just how stiff these japanese measurements are.
The benefit of the japanses brands when set up right will out perfom anything else custom and cost more but its the setup which is the problem! I'm possibly thinking the 14 kgs2 and a 12kgs2 will be an awesome set up and if I was in japan im sure the deciosion would only take a few minutes.
I guess its the stupid problem of going low is not a good option for our roads!

Im sure this problem is common and they have found it before

I'm sure stocks would help me out but they would also say the cars probably to low, in fairness it is, but it aint the only low car out there!

cheers......Hayden
P.S anyone thinking about suspension upgrades should possibly talk to stocks first! I'm gonna end up spending nearly $4500 before its all fine and dandy!!!

PM Serran and ask him what he's using for racing, and ask Boothy what he's got.

Then get something softer than either of them!! :lol:

I haven't started on springs yet, but I'm sure they're measured in lbs/inch (so many pounds to squeeze it an inch) or kg/mm.

I think that if you divide lb/inch by 53, you will get kg/mm

and if you multiply kg/mm by 53 you will get lb/inch, so you're running 530lb/inch & 370lb/inch.

using flex right now with 10kg front 8kg rear.. but moving onto tein ra's next month (rs's are now discontinued).. but they use the same spring hardness of 18front 16 rear.

the hardest setting with flex is quite bumpy on our sydney roads with street tyres.. but a little softer with r-spec tyres.. softest setting is quite comfortable (but much noticable harder than stock)... its all personal preferance of course.

If you use a wider tyre at the back you can use equal stiffness springs front & rear.

OMG!

How does that work RS?? Anyone tried it with equal spring rates and the same size rims, then switched to wider rims?

I had Tein HA's which are 12kg front & rear.

It would swing the tail on hard deceleration when I had same size tires all round. I adjusting the damping, but that only screwed up the handling elsewhere. Finally went to a 255 at the back (225's in the fr) & the problem was more or less solved. However, I have to set the damping on the rear harder now so that it doesn't power understeer.

Well, that is worth knowing.

I hope eveyone reads this when their swapping springs around.

Sorry guys, been away for a day or two.
Cheers for you help. Im thinking about going for a 14kg fornt and 12kg rear! but still not sure if this will be good enough!
Do you think a 16kg front and 14kg rear would be to stiff!

hey Serran , does this mean your getting 18kg fronts and 16kg's rears! thats a big jump! why you go with so much harder of a spring rate? Is your car preety low! I still want to keep the front tyre just under rthe guards!

yep yep exactly with me also... but in general its the same with most cars.. well, all of the cars that do circuit with us..

12+12 is still reasonably civilized in a Altezza. 18+16 would be hardcore and could start shaking bits loose. :angry:

My HA's didn't have rebound damping control & I suspect that if I could've firmed up the rebound, some of the tail happiness might have been solved.

Interestingly enough, a quick browse through the tezza bible nets:

C-One Motorsport Altezza: F12 R10 (setup for 'Light Street')
Night Pager Altezza: F10 R12 (setup for circuit)
Sard Altezza: F14 R14 (setup for 'super street')
Top Secret: F18 R20 (street to circuit)
Signal Auto Altezza: F18 R16 (super street)
Apex Altezza: F14 R9 (street turbo)
HKS street Altezza: F16 R12 (street)

and last but by no means least, the TRD Altezza: F9 R10 (street)

Of course it also lists the HKS Race Altezza at F23 R21.2, but that doesn't really count.

not to mention bilstein type r kit does it for our cars at 40(f) and 35® :blink:

Now that I'm reading the catalogue-

TRD Sportivo F 5.3, R 5.7 drop 20mm both ends.

TRD Height adjustable F 12, R 10 drop 30mm both ends.

Both sets for SXE 10 & GXE 10

The JCE 10 has 8.8 & 8.0 sportivo springs to give the 20mm drop.

(Figures as posted by Chisang on the SG forums)

- note that these are standard spring rates, and most coilover kits let you choose/change your spring rate front and rear.

FRONT/REAR IN KG/MM - LIST PRICE in SG$

HKS HIPER MAX LS+ 8/8 - 2643
C-ONE TPYE G 12/10 - 5000
TOM'S ADVOX 5.7/3.7 - 4393
TRD SUSKIT CIRCUIT 12/10 - 3393
BIOT SPORT 9/8 - 3804
BIOT COMFORT 8/7 - 3625
HKS HIPER MAX PRO 16/12 - 3715
HKS HIPER MAX II 10/9 - 3179
K'POWER'S SPL 14/12 - 6922
WIN RACING 8/6 - 4822
GAB PROSSO 14/12 - 3179
BIOT LEGER STREET 8/7 - 3482
OHLINS 9/7 - 4965
QUANTUM CR 16/14 - 8358
QUANTUM RS 16/14 - 7644
QUANTUM RM 16/14 - 6215
JIC SF-1 14/10 - 2679
SUSTEC PRO S-S 10/8 - 2643
TEIN SUPER STREET 8/6 - 2018
TEIN HA 12/12 - 3107
TEIN CS 8/6 - 3339
TEIN RA 18/16 - 3822
TEIN RS 18/16 - 5036
AMUSE HI-TECH 6/4 - 4490
BILSTEIN ETS HA 10/8 - 4429
SARD GT SPEC C 14/14 - 3893
APEX'I N1 STREET 10/7 - 4429
K-TU:NE 12~16/8~12 - 4072
YZ SUSPENSION 8~16/6~12 - 3357
MAX RACING 16/14 - 6463
BIOT UN 10/9 - 4250
BIOT DEUX 12+3/10+3 - 4429
BIOT TROIS 10/9+3 - 4518
BIOT QUATRE 13+3/11+3 - 4697
BIOT LEGER SPORTS 10/9 - 3482
ZEAL B6 14~16/10~12 - 3840
ZEAL S6 14~16/10~12 - 4429
ZEAL SUPER FUNCTION 20/18 - 4786
ZEAL XS 14/10 - 3536
ZEAL X 16/12 - 4242
CUSCO ZERO 1 12/9 - 2429
CUSCO ZERO 2 12/9 - 3000
AXIA SPORTS 16/12 - 5322
KG/MM DNA 12/10 - 3357
IDEELL LCN 12/6 - 3000
JIC FLT-2 14/10 - 3036
JIC FLT-A2 14/10 - 3304
RACING GEAR RG JTC'NA CIRCUIT 12/8 - 4243
SUSTEC PRO R-R 16/16 - 3357
TEIN FLEX 10/8 - 2929
FIGHTEX DA 12/9 - 3536
ARAGOSTA 9.3/8.8 - 4786
BUDDY CLUB 12/10 - 3179

are yours those TRD ones near the top matt? 12/10 looks tight and with FLEX only 10/8 i might look into some more serious springs down the track....

With the coilover springs, does it mean the springs are at full efficiency when the coilovers are set to their hardest setting?

i was to shake the teeth out of my head with my coilovers

Yes, my TRD SUS Kit runs 12/10, which is considered a standard street setting...

Dont mean to sound DUH!! im getting a set of Tein SS next week. I hear half saying that its good for normal street use, and the other saying its to hard. This is making me think twice about getting it.

HELP pls!

Unless you can drive another car with the same setup, and the same spring rates, then the only way to really know is to try it yourself. Everyone is different - what is too stiff for some is not stiff enough for the next person. Which is why you hear such varying reports from people. My advice: suck it and see.

...and remember you can't alter the rate of a spring once it's made.

So adjusting the coilover base alters the ride height, but will not alter stiffness.

Adjusting the shock absorber rate will alter the stiffness, so maybe its a matter of what shock rate you use with a spring to get a good ride.

Serran should know all about this...

Thanx for your advise Thunderbird and Greeneyes...Just one more question though. Will the Tein SS fit straight into my 1999 RS200? As it came out of a 2001 RS200? Once again Thanx for your help.

SHODEN

As far as I know Toyota never changed the Altezza mounting points at all, so suspension from a '98 should go straight onto a 2005.

Good luck with them! Let us know what they feel like.

PS. To convert from kGf/mm to kN/m

Spring rate (kGf/mm) = A
Spring rate (kN/mm) = (A / 101.1796) X 1000